freeagentAMD is pretty good.. but I wouldn't count Intel out yet. Sure they are in a bad stretch.. but so was AMD. I think some are too quick to judge.. The last time AMD stole Intel's thunder for an extended period like this.. the people at Intel became properly motivated, and it took AMD a decade to recover. Right now AMD is properly motivated, but for how long? None of us are employed by Intel or AMD, so we are in no position to predict the future.

Will Ryzen be the next Toledo?

Stay tuned to find out :laugh:

Actually if you're following the ARMverse Intel's in a much bigger, almost black hole sized, pickle right now!
www.anandtech.com/print/16315/the-ampere-altra-review

Where Ampere and the Altra definitely is beating AMD in is TCO, or total cost of ownership. Taking the flagship models as comparison points – the Q80-33 costs only $4050 which generally matching the performance of AMD’s EPYC 7742 which still comes in at $6950, essentially 42% cheaper. Of course, performance/$ will vary depending on workloads, but the Altra’s performance is so good that I don’t think it really changes the narrative of that large a cost difference. We’re really on basing this on both companies’ MSRP prices and we know for a fact many customers will be paying less than that for volume purchases and relying on discounts, but that can also apply to Ampere and the Altra.

One will note I didn’t make any mention of Intel yet - Intel’s current Xeon offering simply isn’t competitive in any way or form at this moment in time. Cascade Lake is twice as slow and half as efficient – so unless Intel is giving away the chips at a fraction of a price, they really make no sense. Ice Lake-SP is around the corner, but I don’t expect it to manage to bridge the performance or efficiency gap. Ampere and AMD here have free reign on the server market share – with Ampere having to cross the hurdle to convince customers to switch over from x86 to Arm.

Ampere is already shipping Altra systems to customers, with Oracle’s cloud business being the first big notable win for the company – signifying already very positive reactions in the market.

What we need to keep in mind though, is that today’s comparisons were against AMD’s EPYC 7742 which was launched almost 15 months ago. Rome’s successor, Milan, is already shipping to customers and has already started hitting the channel, and we expect to hear more about the Zen3-based EPYC chips in the coming weeks. I’m not expecting major leaps, but a 20% performance bump is pretty much a safe bet to make – it would beat the Q80-33 in more workloads and shift the balance a bit – but Ampere’s aggressive pricing would still be something for AMD to worry about.

What really excites me, is the potential of future Altra designs. Ampere has already announced that Altra-Max “Mystique” will be coming in 2021 – essentially a 128-core version of the same Neoverse-N1 platform used in the QuickSilver design today. We’ll have to see how that scales, but it’ll certainly be a compute monster. The real big deal will be the 5nm 2022 “Siryn” design – if Ampere adopts the Neoverse-V1 CPU core from Arm, and I hope they will, then that would signify at minimum a +50% performance uplift, which is massive.

The Altra overall is an astounding achievement – the company has managed to meet, and maybe even surpass all expectations out of this first-generation design. With one fell swoop Ampere managed to position itself as a top competitor in the server CPU market. The Arm server dream is no longer a dream, it’s here today, and it’s real.

Basically Intel would have to double their overall performance, which isn't too hard to achieve tbf with increased core counts, besides more than doubling the efficiency & yet they might still fall short of zen4 or whatever next gen server uarch ARM releases!

biffzinkerEdit: Would of been nice if Intel had put in the bare minimum iGPU for Rocket Lake leaving room on die for ten cores.

Intel Xe will be used. It's AMD who doesn't put igpu's on chips that aren't apus. ;)

TomgangMore seriously, I have been thinking Intel is EOL them self.

Lol...seriously? Intel eol? Are you trolling?

15th WarlockAnd what makes you say that?

Actually they hold their own pretty well in gaming, among the top 5 processors in gaming as a matter of fact for the 10850KA, and readily available too (unlike the competition), sure, this specific variant, the Avengers edition is EOL (it was a limited edition to begin with anyway...) but that doesn't make them any less valuable as gaming CPUs, especially when price to performance ratio is taken into consideration.

Z490 is upgrade ready for Rocket lake, and PCIE4.0 ready, so there's a clear upgrade path for the platform, so idk why these processors are looked down upon.

we went through this in another thread with multiple people... add one more...or maybe this is 2x for zonedynamo.

AMD is suddenly has a small lead across the board and intel's chip are shit. Go back 3 generations when amd cpus were actually shit compared to intel and people were still on amd's tip. Trololollololulz...i swear the general populous of this place gets more ridiculous by the week. :(

EarthDogIntel Xe will be used. It's AMD who doesn't put igpu's on chips that aren't apus. ;)

Lol...seriously? Intel eol? Are you trolling?

we went through this in another thread with multiple people... add one more...or maybe this is 2x for zonedynamo.

AMD is suddenly has a small lead across the board and intel's chip are shit. Go back 3 generations when amd cpus were actually shit compared to intel and people were still on amd's tip. Trololollololulz...i swear the general populous of this place gets more ridiculous by the week. :(

It has little to do with AMD. It has everything to do their inability to get the mess straightened out at their fabs and get anything new out the door. TSMC is what they have to worry about. They keep falling farther behind and have shown absolutely nothing to inspire one iota of confidence that they will ever catch up.

I'm not an engineer, so I cant comment on their manufacturing issues but..

Like the great Joe Rogan once said:

If I gave you a hammer and sent you off into the woods, how long until you can send me an email?

I'm reading some of these comments like how hard can it be to shrink this shit guys? C'mon and pull your balls together its not rocket science FFS!

Lol :laugh:

I'm sure there is a little math involved. But I'm also sure once they nail it the competition will be on again which is great for you and me.

freeagentI'm not an engineer, so I cant comment on their manufacturing issues but..

Like the great Joe Rogan once said:

If I gave you a hammer and sent you off into the woods, how long until you can send me an email?

I'm reading some of these comments like how hard can it be to shrink this shit guys? C'mon and pull your balls together its not rocket science FFS!

Lol :laugh:

I'm sure there is a little math involved. But I'm also sure once they nail it the competition will be on again which is great for you and me.

It is much more complicated than that. Intel have made no progress in a span of about 5 years and they are up against a foe that has much more resources at its disposal. Plus they apparently have much better management and effective engineering at TSMC.

I agree with you, too many chiefs in the wigwam.. Lots of new faces too, so this is a learning experience for them as well.. hard lessons are always the best lessons.

bmacsysIt has little to do with AMD. It has everything to do their inability to get the mess straightened out at their fabs and get anything new out the door. TSMC is what they have to worry about. They keep falling farther behind and have shown absolutely nothing to inspire one iota of confidence that they will ever catch up.

falling further behind? This is the first gen they actually fell behind, bud. Nice try though. :)

EarthDogIntel Xe will be used. It's AMD who doesn't put igpu's on chips that aren't apus. ;)

Lol...seriously? Intel eol? Are you trolling?

we went through this in another thread with multiple people... add one more...or maybe this is 2x for zonedynamo.

AMD is suddenly has a small lead across the board and intel's chip are shit. Go back 3 generations when amd cpus were actually shit compared to intel and people were still on amd's tip. Trololollololulz...i swear the general populous of this place gets more ridiculous by the week. :(

No i´m not trolling...well maybe a little. But seriously, intel has been on 14 NM since 2014 for laptops (i know some of the laptops are 10 NM cpu now) and since 2015 for desktop. But from 2015 and well into the end of 2021 they are still using 14 NM and are going back from 10 cores to 8 cores as well. If that dosent scream EOL, i dont know what do. First with Alder Lake by the end of 2021, they will be moving on to 10 NM for desktop and at that time AMD is on 5 NM with Zen 4. I really feel intel is EOL or at least there best days is a thing of the past. They have some chasting up to do, if you ask me.

Rocket lake dosent change my plans for a Zen 3 build. Even if Rocket lake again takes the gaming crown back, it´s still 14 NM meaning high power consumtion and in raw multi core performance rocket lake dosent stand a chance againt zen 3 12 and 16 core chips. In short, intel is not the winner this round of CPU battle in my opinion.

There is a difference between losing your first overall battle in over a decade to suddenly intel being EOL. Get grip and stop trolling, lol.

So few need more than 8c/16t it almost makes sense. If you need more go amd if you want mainstream, go hedt for Intel/amd... consoles just got 8c/16t man..

AMD started a core war...nobody wants to take part right now. A few faster cores is how most software and games work. It's not like the software in the market is starving for cores... come on now. They're milking the ignorant imo. Half the people look and think...well 12 cores has to be better than 8...its more! Akd while that is true, it's only when you can actually use/utilize those cores do they become beneficial. Otherwise, like buying an overkill psu, all it does is hurt you wallet... and chances are, by the time 12/16c can be used, the clu will be too slow anyway compared to what's out.

Literally, nobody cares, or even knows, about 14nm vs 10nm. All they see is performance, price and power consumption... performance is close all around, but power is higher and pricing, generally higher (non K chips offered a great value on the Intel side).

EarthDogfalling further behind? This is the first gen they actually fell behind, bud. Nice try though. :)

Earthdog, you just don't get it. They are getting killed in every metric by TSMC and there is no light at the end of the tunnel for them. Intels prowess was due to being two nodes ahead of everyone else. Now they are way behind with no plan in place to catch up. It has nothing to do with cores, clockspeed, AMD.

bmacsysEarthdog, you just don't get it. They are getting killed in every metric by TSMC and there is no light at the end of the tunnel for them. Intels prowess was due to being two nodes ahead of everyone else. Now they are way behind with no plan in place to catch up. It has nothing to do with cores, clockspeed, AMD.

I get it... and am not worried in the least. Wait until they get on their horse. It may be a generation or two past RL, but intel isn't "eol" and their chips aren't 'shit'. Outside of power use, they are competitive in most metrics (even at the current node). They'll be fine. :)

Post 35 offers details.;)

W1zzardDid anyone here actually buy one of those? Or know someone who bought it?

i just got one from amazon when i bought a 10850k.
it wasn't even listed as one.

WarTherapy1195i just got one from amazon when i bought a 10850k.
it wasn't even listed as one.

Keep the box, it will most likely be a collectors item later.

EarthDogI get it... and am not worried in the least.

It's good that you aren't but Intel should be petrified right about now. Altra & ARM have done what was thought nigh impossible, DCG is the actual fuel that allows Intel to expand its business & control the near monopoly power it enjoys in servers. This is a tectonic shift, with the M1 it was clear what Apple/ARM could achieve at the low ultra portable & efficient end but with this the top end is almost taken over! Now it's actually Intel that's chasing a moving & the lead seems to only grow with Intel fumbling at every step, we've seen much bigger giants taken down. Intel may still be solvent by the end of 2030 but they'll not have 98~99% server share that's 100% certain. With the way things stand they'd be lucky to end up in AMD's position a decade from now :shadedshu:

R0H1TActually if you're following the ARMverse Intel's in a much bigger, almost black hole sized, pickle right now!
www.anandtech.com/print/16315/the-ampere-altra-review



Basically Intel would have to double their overall performance, which isn't too hard to achieve tbf with increased core counts, besides more than doubling the efficiency & yet they might still fall short of zen4 or whatever next gen server uarch ARM releases!

This I agree. I think a lot of people only see this as a 2 way fight between Intel and AMD. But ARM is actually the bigger threat to Intel. The recent news of Amazon and Apple switching to their in house ARM processor is an example of the significant inroad made by ARM base chips. AMD is gaining market shares from Intel, but I think the number is still not that significant.

From a power efficiency standpoint, I don't think Intel has a chance to compete with their existing product stack. ARM chips are build for low power in the first place, and they still hold the crown after so many years.

They sure use some really big words for some shit products.

Wow..

The ignorance is astronomical.

Carry on with your arm chair analytics.