Wednesday, October 6th 2021

Intel's Pat Gelsinger Exclaims "Intel is Back" AMD is "Over"

Intel's recently appointed CEO wasn't mincing words in a recent interview with CRN, where he claimed that Intel not only "have the best product" but also that "this period of time when people could say, "Hey, [AMD] is leading," that's over." We'd say them are fighting words, regardless of what various leaks have suggested, since Intel still has a lot to prove with its upcoming Alder Lake CPUs.

Gelsinger continues with "We have 80 percent market share. We have the best software assets that are available in the industry. We do the best job supporting our partners and our OEMs with it. We have an incredible brand that our channel partners, customers want and trust. Wow, that's a lot of assets in that. If the channel partner doesn't see value in that, I want to talk to him." It's pretty clear from this that Intel believes that they're doing a bang up job and if their customers don't see it, then they need a talking to.
For those that were hoping for an engineer to be at the reins of Intel again, the interview with CRN reads like a marketing spinner is at the head of the company. "We are back with a very defined view of what it requires to be leadership in every dimension: leadership product, leadership [chip] packaging, leadership process, leadership software, unquestioned leadership on critical new workloads like AI, graphics, media, power-performance, enabling again the ecosystem. This is what we will be doing with aggressive actions and programs over the next couple of years." How Intel is planning to take the lead in the graphics market is going to be interesting to see if nothing else.

Most of the interview is about how Intel is planning on growing its channel and partner ecosystem, but the article also touches on things like Apple, although once again, Gelsinger dismisses Apple's move away from Intel hardware by saying " We ultimately see the real competition to enable the ecosystem to compete with Apple". This suggests that he doesn't seem to understand why Apple decided to make its own processors in the first place. He also doesn't seem to be a fan of what he calls "Apples closed garden" while calling Windows an "open ecosystem".

When asked how Intel is going to be able to compete with AMD and the various Arm based server parts from companies like Amazon and Ampere, he simply answers "do better products". It's hard to take that kind of an answer seriously and although Intel is hardly in a situation where they're likely to end up on the brink of ruin any time soon, the company has been losing ground in both the server, desktop and notebook markets over the past couple of years.

Gelsinger isn't expecting any further slips in terms of market share, mostly due to the fact that neither Intel or AMD can increase their production at the moment and the situation is likely the same for the Arm based server chip makers. Furthermore, he's expecting pricing to remain stable, although this seems to be referring to server parts, as consumer CPUs aren't discussed in the article. He doesn't see a thread from Arm based server CPUs either, claiming that they have a "very minimal" market share today and will continue to do so.

One interesting quote about the consumer PC side is that he believes that with Alder Lake, Intel will have the "energy efficiency leadership", something no-one else is expecting. That said, it seems like he does have some respect for AMD, saying "AMD has done a solid job over the last couple of years. We won't dismiss them of the good work that they've done". It'll be interesting to see how this unfolds over the next couple of generations of CPUs from both companies, as Intel still has a lot to prove with its new CPU designs.
Source: CRN
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162 Comments on Intel's Pat Gelsinger Exclaims "Intel is Back" AMD is "Over"

#126
AusWolf
ValantarSpecifically: rich kid swinging their pocketbook around (presenting Epic as if it's meaningfully richer than Valve is just silly - they're both mega-rich corporations); the CEO ego part (yes, Newell is far less visible and loud, but he wholly embraces the way the gaming community deifies him - different personality types, similar levels of ego); the exclusivity argument isn't a direct mirroring, but Steam's de facto monopoly and the inherent threat of losing money if you don't put your game on Steam makes this more than a match for any exclusivity payments Epic has made.
What threat?

Monopoly or not, I like keeping my games in the same space. Apart from that, paying 20 quid on Steam, or anywhere else doesn't make a difference to me.
ValantarI also haven't seen any indication of Epic being opposed to PC gaming (or flip-flopping) at least since they opened the EGS. Now, two and a half years isn't a lot to go off of, but that argument goes both ways.
They're opposed to PC gaming via any different storefront than their own. They're not even bothered to innovate, or lower prices at least. They just force developers into exclusivity deals, which is outright disgusting.
ValantarI frankly have no idea what software integrates with Steam - in my experience Valve wants their own solutions or none at all. No doubt there is all kinds of stuff I don't know of though. The only integration with EGS that I've come across is GOG Galaxy (which Steam notably lacks official integration with), which works very well.
As far as I've seen, GOG Galaxy has the best integration with anything, so a big kudos to them for that.
ValantarI mean, you can argue that EGS lacks features just as you can argue that Steam's UI (and especially the overlay) are hopelessly dated and impractical. Both are true, and neither is a deal-breaker to me. They're just different. And more options = more betterer.
I like Steam especially because of its "dated" UI. Dated here means more logical, as is the case with most websites too. UI designers tend to focus on looks and lose out big time on functionality nowadays.

Anyhow, no need to turn this thread into another EGS vs Steam discussion, so I'm done. :) Sorry for the off.
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#127
Vayra86
Darmok N JaladThis is also the same company that provided chips to Apple for years, but now that that is over they are now actively campaigning against them by promoting touchscreens and such.

The leaks of Adler Lake have me skeptical. The little cores are only found on expensive SKUs, suggesting that is a core-war gimmick, Windows 11 is likely going to be needed to get the best results, and more than anything, I would like to see some reviews that show that runaway power consumption is a thing of the past. Intel has a lot to prove, IMO. When they were dominant, they didn’t talk about “the competition,” so the fact that they are having some hard feelings suggests this will be an RX580 moment—designs pushed to the limit to get some performance credibility back. I guess we’ll find out.
Writing on the wall: We saw the exact same 650 points ST performance on the Alder Lake P cores running at 4 Ghz - the same as Ryzen.

At 5 Ghz, they are unlocked and have a 50% higher power budget.

/Alder Lake thread. They can match Ryzen IPC now at 4Ghz, which isn't bad. But its not going to change the world for MSDT, in fact, its a complete standstill because you don't want to push ADL higher because you're back in retarded TDP land again sooner rather than later. But... P cores cap out at 8. So yes the E cores are marketing cores, for MSDT. For mobile, which is their core consumer market, they may extract a lead on the Zen stack... but the Ryzen G's come with a solid IGP on top.

Net result nothing really changes, but there is fair playing ground now on price and performance. Until AMD releases something again. All is well. But in some minds apparently Intel or AMD can only crush everything or die completely... when in fact they exist for many years doing better or worse. Alder Lake is pretty meaningless to me, as a consumer. I'm fine with any CPU from the last 3-5 generations really. There are no low hanging fruits left in CPU land, not even for gaming.
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#128
londiste
Vayra86/Alder Lake thread. They can match Ryzen IPC now at 4Ghz, which isn't bad.
The suspicion is that they can match Zen3 single-core performance at 4GHz which would imply it has higher IPC since Zen3 single-core tests run at 4.4-4.8GHz or so. We will have to wait and see and that Alder Lake's 4GHz might be misread by software for now.
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#129
Vayra86
londisteThe suspicion is that they can match Zen3 single-core performance at 4GHz which would imply it has higher IPC since Zen3 single-core tests run at 4.4-4.8GHz or so. We will have to wait and see and that Alder Lake's 4GHz might be misread by software for now.
10% IPC at intel versus core count at AMD sounds a lot like been there seen that since forever... ;)
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#131
Valantar
Vayra8610% IPC at intel versus core count at AMD sounds a lot like been there seen that since forever... ;)
Then there's the upcoming 3D cache Zen3(+?) chips, and then there's Zen4. Of course these aren't arriving soon (just confirmed 3D cache CPUs for Q1 '22, I'd guess that makes Zen 4 EOY-ish), but ... meh. It's going to be close either way. It might very well be that Intel takes back the IPC and/or absolute performance crown, but they won't be resting easy. And that's fantastic!
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#132
medi01
TheinsanegamerNa platform that is missing tons of features
Yeah, a ton of "checklist of shit 90%+ of users never use" stuff. Convincing.
TheinsanegamerNhas terrible software integration,
As in "I've heard these words, but am not sure what they mean".
TheinsanegamerNa CEO with an ego
Ah. Ok. Now it seems almost totally, but not completely, not rational.
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#133
londiste
ValantarThen there's the upcoming 3D cache Zen3(+?) chips, and then there's Zen4. Of course these aren't arriving soon (just confirmed 3D cache CPUs for Q1 '22, I'd guess that makes Zen 4 EOY-ish), but ... meh. It's going to be close either way. It might very well be that Intel takes back the IPC and/or absolute performance crown, but they won't be resting easy. And that's fantastic!
Competition is fantastic :)

Alder Lake should be going up against Zen3+3D Cache.
AMD now basically confirmed previous leaked roadmaps where the other interesting and so far unconfirmed part is Zen4 and AM5 at Q4 2022.
Intel leaked roadmaps put Raptor Lake within a quarter of that so this should get interesting.
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#134
HD64G
Now that I know windows 11's broken CPU scheduler for Ryzen CPUs will be broken at least until AL launch, I fully understand his confidense on "AMD is over"... Let's see who will be the reviewer to test objectively. Most will know who is a shill after that launch.
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#135
zlobby
HD64GNow that I know windows 11's broken CPU scheduler for Ryzen CPUs will be broken at least until AL launch, I fully understand his confidense on "AMD is over"... Let's see who will be the reviewer to test objectively. Most will know who is a shill after that launch.
Not we don't already know who is a hardcore shill 'reviewer' and who isn't. Well, there is always room for new discoveries, though.

I can imagine how pissed @W1zzard and his crew must be, waiting for some stable build, only so that they can redo all their tests in the lasy minute.
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#136
W1zzard
zlobbyI can imagine how pissed @W1zzard and his crew must be, waiting for some stable build, only so that they can redo all their tests in the lasy minute.
I'm already setting up test systems, but yeah, the situation isn't ideal.
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#137
HD64G
W1zzardI'm already setting up test systems, but yeah, the situation isn't ideal.
In what platform will you test AMD CPUs for this review may I ask? I am not you ofc but I would just use the latest results you already have from previous reviews. Why bother and lose time battling with a broken for the AMD CPUs OS? AL on the other hand will need Win11 to perform optimally.
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#138
W1zzard
HD64GIn what platform will you test AMD CPUs for this review may I ask? I am not you ofc but I would just use the latest results you already have from previous reviews. Why bother and lose time battling with a broken for the AMD CPUs OS? AL on the other hand will need Win11 to perform optimally.
For a fair comparison I must test on the same OS as Alder Lake? And obviously testing Alder Lake on Windows 10 makes no sense? Even though these could be interesting separate investigations
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#139
zlobby
W1zzardEven though these could be interesting separate investigations
The beauty of indepenent journalism! Get busy, Busy Bee! :D
londisteCompetition is fantastic :)
Yep! Now every company will try hard to make things work in their favor, ultimately benefiting all users. If we exclude any potential bias M$ may have towards a certain company, that is.
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#140
HD64G
W1zzardFor a fair comparison I must test on the same OS as Alder Lake? And obviously testing Alder Lake on Windows 10 makes no sense? Even though these could be interesting separate investigations
Since win10 and win11 are underneath mostly the same OS in most ways than not, and since the fairness means to not allow any bottleneck for each platform, my view on this case is to test with the best OS for each one. As for GPUs the best is to test the one that works better with DX11 with this and the one better with DX12 with that, since there is a free of cost and easy option.
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#141
TheoneandonlyMrK
W1zzardFor a fair comparison I must test on the same OS as Alder Lake? And obviously testing Alder Lake on Windows 10 makes no sense? Even though these could be interesting separate investigations
I'm all for interesting investigation.

You are implying no one would use win 10 on Aderlake, for gaming that makes sense, but actually for office, work based tests the opposite is true since most companies will take years to adopt windows 11, just as they took years moving off every other OS, shit test Xp too, no I jest :p

And regardless Intel , Microsoft and AMD have certainly created the perfect, benching shitfest for some poor soul, I wouldn't want to be that writer, he or she can't win here.
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#142
Bubster
No you're NOT The Terminator, You're NOT BACK yet...
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#143
W1zzard
TheoneandonlyMrKYou are implying no one would use win 10 on Aderlake, for gaming that makes sense, but actually for office, work based tests the opposite is true since most companies will take years to adopt windows 11,
They will use Windows 10 on their old hardware for eternity, but not on new Alder Lake systems. It'll sure be an interesting article running ADL on W10, but since W10 doesn't know big.LITTLE it will either schedule loads on the slow atom cores, or not schedule anything on them at all and only use the big cores.
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#144
kane nas
[MEDIA=twitter]1448310872812650510[/MEDIA]
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#145
TheoneandonlyMrK
W1zzardThey will use Windows 10 on their old hardware for eternity, but not on new Alder Lake systems. It'll sure be an interesting article running ADL on W10, but since W10 doesn't know big.LITTLE it will either schedule loads on the slow atom cores, or not schedule anything on them at all and only use the big cores.
Maybe/ Probably, it is (W10)likely to get updated eventually, they buckle easily.
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#146
W1zzard
TheoneandonlyMrKMaybe/ Probably, it is (W10)likely to get updated eventually, they buckle easily.
I doubt it. Every new PC will be sold with Windows 11 soon, so there's no financial incentive for anyone to backport ADL support to W10
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#147
TheoneandonlyMrK
W1zzardI doubt it. Every new PC will be sold with Windows 11 soon, so there's no financial incentive for anyone to backport ADL support to W10
We willll see I suppose.

I doubted companies would update because of legacy apps etc but after thinking about it the powers that be tend to have opted for payed for web based applications to do, ahem help them do they're job's these days, automated IT and HR, joy, you might be right.

A few companies I have worked at had offline special concession PC's for jobs like flashing hardware so to be fair legacy is half ass covered anyway.
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#148
GURU7OF9
W1zzardFor a fair comparison I must test on the same OS as Alder Lake? And obviously testing Alder Lake on Windows 10 makes no sense? Even though these could be interesting separate investigations
Win 11 is specifically built for ADL so it is logical to test it on that platform. But Win11 is also known to be broken for Ryzen.
So how do you have a fair comparison if you know Win 11 is broken on AMD Ryzen ?
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#149
TheoneandonlyMrK
GURU7OF9Win 11 is specifically built for ADL so it is logical to test it on that platform. But Win11 is also known to be broken for Ryzen.
So how do you have a fair comparison if you know Win 11 is broken on AMD Ryzen ?
Fingers crossed for AMDs driver squad, but to be fair it's going to be On AMD , windows 11 can't have slipped under they're radar, I'm not keen on unfair comparison but the truth tends to wash out doesn't it.
What can anyone but AMD do, the opposite (W10 benches)is also unfair.

W10(Ryzen) verses W11(Intel) also isn't fair and I am not sure it would go as you might expect, I think W11 will have optimization to be done.
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#150
GURU7OF9
TheoneandonlyMrKFingers crossed for AMDs driver squad, but to be fair it's going to be On AMD , windows 11 can't have slipped under they're radar, I'm not keen on unfair comparison but the truth tends to wash out doesn't it.
What can anyone but AMD do, the opposite (W10 benches)is also unfair.
Which gets back to testing both ADL and Ryzen on both Win10 and Win 11 .
You will get a broader fairer spread of results.
You would expect it to show ADL is faster on Win11 and Ryzen is faster on Win 10 at this point in time and as for comparisons against one one another we shall see in due course.
Even if Ryzen was fixed now for Win11, its probly too late to be included !
I honestly can't see any other way to do it fairly but we already know that wont happen here ! Obviously it would be double the work !
Be interesting to see what other reviewers choose to do !
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