Wednesday, June 13th 2018

Intel Readying 22-core LGA2066 and 8-core LGA1151 Processors

Intel is readying a refresh to its "Basin Falls" HEDT platform (LGA2066 client high-end desktop), with a new 22-core silicon. This part is neither Skylake HCC (20 tiles, up to 18 cores) nor Skylake XCC (30 tiles, up to 28 cores), but a new die with four more tiles than the Skylake HCC silicon, all of which are cores. The new silicon could let Intel design 20-core and 22-core SKUs for the X299 Express chipset, and is seen as a direct response to AMD's 24-core Ryzen Threadripper II processor, which was recently shown beating the 18-core i9-7980X in tech demos. The 32-core Threadripper II could face competition from the 28-core HEDT processor Intel is readying for Q4-2018, but that processor won't be compatible with LGA2066.

In related news, the company is giving finishing touches to a new 8-core "Coffee Lake" die for the mainstream-desktop platform (LGA1151 socket, 300-series chipset). This die features 8 cores, and likely 16 MB of shared L3 cache, while retaining the iGPU and uncore components from the existing Coffee Lake-S die. The chip could retain the classic "Ring Bus" design. The new 8-core mainstream-desktop SKUs, and at least two new high-end desktop SKUs (20-core and 22-core), could be launched in September 2018. The "Basin Falls" refresh, coupled with the new LGA3647 "Purley" derivative for the 28-core monstrosity, will be all Intel has to face AMD this year, with the company's next HEDT silicon, "Cascade Lake-X" being reportedly delayed to the second half of 2019, probably due to foundry problems.
Source: PC Watch
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40 Comments on Intel Readying 22-core LGA2066 and 8-core LGA1151 Processors

#1
Fourstaff
Exciting times. Where there is healthy competition everybody wins.
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#2
Hood
It seems like yesterday we were stuck on 4 cores, and even HEDT only had 6 (Ivy Bridge in 2013). Not sure if I should thank AMD or curse them.
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#3
dj-electric
LGA2066 is getting improved in the wrong direction in my opinion.
I know more cores is important for rendering, but there are some really important improvements that need to happen to this platform.

- Thermals have to come down with a better TIM application, dealing with the heat of those CPUs is the biggest challenge i have ever met.
- Motherboards have to become more robust in the VRM cooling and power delivery dept.
- Branding has to start making sense already. No more sub 8-core CPUs please.
- CPU pricing needs to start being more compelling. TR is a wake up call.
- Quicker catch up with mainstream technology is needed. You can't let mainstream enjoy new ports and technologies, and deliver it to HEDT a whole year later.
Posted on Reply
#4
Totally
"dj-electric said:
LGA2066 is getting improved in the wrong direction in my opinion.
I know more cores is important for rendering, but there are some really important improvements that need to happen to this platform.

- Thermals have to come down with a better TIM application, dealing with the heat of those CPUs is the biggest challenge i have ever met.
- Motherboards have to become more robust in the VRM cooling and power delivery dept.
- Branding has to start making sense already. No more sub 8-core CPUs please.
- CPU pricing needs to start being more compelling. TR is a wake up call.
- Quicker catch up with mainstream technology is needed. You can't let mainstream enjoy new ports and technologies, and deliver it to HEDT a whole year later.
Where were these gripes when AMD was an absentee? Everyone gladly accepted it, now all a sudden these issues are not okay?
Posted on Reply
#5
hat
Enthusiast
"Totally said:
Where were these gripes when AMD was an absentee? Everyone gladly accepted it, now all a sudden these issues are not okay?
Which rock have you been living under? People have been complaining about those things all along. All of them.
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#6
kastriot
At least they didn't made another socket for those cpu-s. :toast:
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#7
mak1skav
Will they be able to run at 5GHz though ?
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#8
First Strike
"Totally said:
Where were these gripes when AMD was an absentee? Everyone gladly accepted it, now all a sudden these issues are not okay?
For your Information, Intel used to solder their HEDT chips before Skylake-X.
And just in the Skylake-X generation, they replaced the soldering with TIMs, along with a core bump from 10 to 18 simultaneously.
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#9
dj-electric
"Totally said:
Where were these gripes when AMD was an absentee? Everyone gladly accepted it, now all a sudden these issues are not okay?
Nobody gladly accepted it. In fact, people were already mad about it at computex itself.
Posted on Reply
#10
Valantar
"mak1skav said:
Will they be able to run at 5GHz though ?
Of course. Always. Single core boost will be 7GHz. While consuming no power, and cooled by convection straight from the IHS.*


*Intel is sorry to inform you that it forgot to mention that none of this is true.


If this report is accurate, it just serves to underscore how utterly useless the new 28-core chips will be. "22 cores not rocking your boat? Here, I have a motherboard for you at 4x the price, that won't fit in your case, with a silly amount of memory channels for any end-user workload. Also, the VRM has a heatsink bigger than your GPU, and the CPU is $4000. Sound good?"

Essentially, if this is true, it just confirms that the 28-core chips are nothing but a knee-jerk reaction to Treadripper 2 (yes, technically demonstrated before, but not exactly requiring a great leap of imagination). "We can also have a silly amount of cores!" Intel still has the IPC and clock speed crown, TR and TR2 is seriously putting the hurt on them in the HEDT workstation world. TR enabled me to build a 12-core video editing rig last year for the same money that would have gotten me a 6 or 8-core Intel chip (with far less PCIe too!). Intel needs to get their act together.
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#11
techy1
"mak1skav said:
Will they be able to run at 5GHz though ?
in intels demo's - yea, sure - 5ghz on all cores, all stock, on air, chip right from the shelf
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#12
Hugh Mungus
"I can't wait for the helios 500 AMD edition MK2!!!" Me, just now.

Feels weird, but it seems right. 12-core 7nm zen 65W and vega 7nm maybe? I hope so much AMD at least gives something remotely like a mobile 7nm gaming version to acer! 30% extra performance wouldn't go amiss, would put it at desktop vega 56 performance!

I'm kinda done with nvidia and Intel for now and my a8 6600k is still going, just.
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#14
GlacierNine
"Totally said:
Where were these gripes when AMD was an absentee? Everyone gladly accepted it, now all a sudden these issues are not okay?
Since you asked...


1 - Thermals have to come down with a better TIM application, dealing with the heat of those CPUs is the biggest challenge i have ever met.

People have been complaining about this since 2012: http://hexus.net/tech/news/cpu/39369-intel-cuts-corners-ivy-bridge-thermal-interface-material-tim/

2 - Motherboards have to become more robust in the VRM cooling and power delivery dept.

This has only been a widespread issue since X299 - X99 VRMs did not have overheating issues becuase the platform's power requirements were dramatically less. Der8auer complained about this issue for the first time on Jun 28th 2017. <div class="youtube-embed" data-id="f7BqAjC4ZCc"><img src="https://i.ytimg.com/vi/f7BqAjC4ZCc/hqdefault.jpg" /><div class="youtube-play"></div><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7BqAjC4ZCc" target="_blank" class="youtube-title"></a></div>

3 - Branding has to start making sense already. No more sub 8-core CPUs please.

Intel have a long history of confusing people with their branding - Here's a couple links and quotes:

https://www.theverge.com/2016/9/2/12754426/intel-core-m-processor-naming-change-confusing - "Intel is making some weird naming changes to its processors this year that are certain to confuse people about what they’re buying. As spotted by Laptop Mag, the Core m name is largely going away in favor of Core i, which means it’s going to be much harder to tell exactly how powerful the processor is inside of a new laptop."

http://www.brucebnews.com/2012/07/how-to-identify-an-ivy-bridge-processor/ - (Confusing footnote: the naming scheme only works up to 37xx. The 38xx and 39xx processors are Sandy Bridge. That’s because Intel hates consumers.)


4 - CPU pricing needs to start being more compelling. TR is a wake up call.

He's got a point, Intel bumped up the price of their top end HEDT CPU from $999 to $1700 between the 5960X and the 6950X, while delivering only 2 more cores and on the same PCH. TR is doing incredibly well with a top end part priced at what Intel were charging before they added $700 to the MSRP. Absolutely a wakeup call to Intel.

- Quicker catch up with mainstream technology is needed. You can't let mainstream enjoy new ports and technologies, and deliver it to HEDT a whole year later.

Honestly, this is the only thing on this list that I've not seen a whole lot of complaints about, but it's always been an issue on the platform - Gigabyte annouced the world's first thunderbolt 3 compatible X99 motherboard on April 13, 2016 - https://www.gigabyte.com/Press/News/1421

Thunderbolt 3 had arrived on Mainstream, also from Gigabyte, on Sep 9th 2015 - https://thepcenthusiast.com/gigabyte-z170x-ud5-th-thunderbolt-3-motherboard/
Posted on Reply
#15
Valantar
"Hugh Mungus said:
Feels weird, but it seems right. 12-core 7nm zen 65W and vega 7nm maybe? I hope so much AMD at least gives something remotely like a mobile 7nm gaming version to acer! 30% extra performance wouldn't go amiss, would put it at desktop vega 56 performance!

I'm kinda done with nvidia and Intel for now and my a8 6600k is still going, just.
Vega 7nm isn't intended for consumers/gaming, and it never has been. Roadmaps have been reasonably clear on this from the start (despite what is being reported due to the leaks/info from Computex regarding Navi). Vega 7nm is meant for compute, machine learning and HPC, and the silicon is designed with features and a design geared specifically for this. It would make no sense to bring this chip to gamers as it would be unnecessarily big, probably not faster, and less efficient than an implementation with those redundant features stripped out. We're all going to have to wait for Navi, I'm afraid. Outside of that really intriguing mobile Vega they showed off at CES, of course. Wonder where that went.
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#16
Caring1
"dj-electric said:
LGA2066 is getting improved in the wrong direction in my opinion.
I know more cores is important for rendering, but there are some really important improvements that need to happen to this platform.
Snip.
I'd like to include power consumption to that list, having MOAR CORES is pointless if you need a nuclear power station to run it.
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#17
GlacierNine
"Caring1 said:
I'd like to include power consumption to that list, having MOAR CORES is pointless if you need a nuclear power station to run it.
Yeah, I definitely don't want to go back to the days of 1.2KW power supplies in gaming rigs, and having to be real careful about what you buy to power a family PC in case they want to put a GPU in it later.

Not to mention cooling. That wasn't a time where you could just buy a 212 and expect to be fine in summer heat. A P4 and 8800GTX could legitimately take you into "space heater" territory in terms of added heat to the room...
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#19
Upgrayedd
All I really want in mainstream is an unlocked i7 CPU with no iGPU. Use that die space for something else. HEDT costs entirely too much now..
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#20
altcapwn
Thanks AMD for the healthy competition.
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#21
Vya Domus
HEDT core counts have literally tripled in the last year went from 10 cores to 32 , that's fucking insane and this time it really is thanks to AMD.
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#22
las
"altcapwn said:
Thanks AMD for the healthy competition.
Yeah better late than never.
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#23
mcraygsx
"mak1skav said:
Will they be able to run at 5GHz though ?
*Facepalm @ Anadtech "Intel’s 28-Core 5 GHz CPU: Coming in Q4".

There are those who still believe just because media told them so.

Posted on Reply
#24
londiste
"Vya Domus said:
HEDT core counts have literally tripled in the last year went from 10 cores to 32 , that's fucking insane and this time it really is thanks to AMD.
i7-6950X is from Q2 2016, 32-core TR will come later this year.

"GlacierNine said:
Not to mention cooling. That wasn't a time where you could just buy a 212 and expect to be fine in summer heat. A P4 and 8800GTX could legitimately take you into "space heater" territory in terms of added heat to the room...
Are you sure your memory serves right? 8800GTX has 155W TDP, latest Prescott P4 Extreme Edition had TDP of 110W. Not quite space heater territory and combined, this is the heat generation of today's higher midrange computer.
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#25
HimymCZe
"Hood said:
It seems like yesterday we were stuck on 4 cores, and even HEDT only had 6 (Ivy Bridge in 2013). Not sure if I should thank AMD or curse them.
Why cursing them? After 4174 days of Quad-Cores we FINALLY have at least a "promise" of upgrade.
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