Friday, April 24th 2020

AMD "Renoir" Successor is "Cézanne," Powered by "Zen 3" and RDNA2

AMD's 7 nm "Renoir" silicon breathed life into the notebook processor market, by bringing 8-core/16-thread CPU performance into segments Intel reserved for 4-core/8-thread; and beat Intel in the iGPU performance front. 7 nm brought performance-Watt uplifts that spell serious competition for Intel across all notebook form factors, be it 15 W or 45 W. According to _rogame, who has a knack of getting far-out hardware rumors right, AMD has its successor on the drawing-board, and it's codenamed "Cézanne," after the French post-impressionist painter Paul Cézanne.

"Cézanne" could prove vital for AMD's foothold in the premium mobile computing segments as Intel is preparing to launch its 10 nm+ "Tiger Lake" processor soon, with advanced "Willow Cove" CPU cores, and Xe based integrated graphics. AMD plans to tap into its very latest IP. Although its core-count is not known, "Cézanne" will feature CPU cores based on the latest "Zen 3" microarchitecture. The iGPU will receive its biggest performance uplift in 3 generations, with an iGPU based on the cutting-edge RDNA2 graphics architecture that meets DirectX 12 Ultimate logo requirements.

AMD is tapping into a refined 7 nm-class node by TSMC - either N7P or N7+ - for its "Zen 3" and RDNA2 architectures, so it's likely that Cézanne will be based on the same node as the CCDs on "Vermeer." AMD will create 15 W and 45 W product lines based on "Cézanne," so it can fight "Tiger Lake" on both segments. There's no word on launch date, but with Intel planning to debut "Tiger Lake" in mid-2020, and AMD planning to debut "Zen 3" in the 2H-2020, a 2020-21 launch window seems probable.
Source: _rogame (Twitter)
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34 Comments on AMD "Renoir" Successor is "Cézanne," Powered by "Zen 3" and RDNA2

#3
Chrispy_
That's great, but none of the Renoir U-series have been made available yet.

They were presumably launched 5 weeks ago along with the H series which is great but the least interesting part of the entire Renoir lineup since the H series will all likely be paired with dGPUs.

The whole point of APUs is the integrated graphics for slim laptops and we've all been waiting since Zen2 launched almost 10 months ago for the same 7nm APUs for power saving and vastly improved performance.

Laptops outsell desktops almost five to one. AMD have screwed up by delaying this long and despite COVID, they chose to lead with their best, newest APU in a model that had no need for tight TDPs, no LPDDR4 to give the APU the crucial extra bandwidth that single-handedly deterimines the performance of the integrated Vega graphics.

"Here's our latest APU designed for LPDDR4-boosted graphics performance at 15W. It's going to be showcased in this hamstrung variant that:
  • isn't 15W
  • doesn't' use our APU's graphics
  • doesn't have LPDDR4
I hope you like seeing how Zen2 performs, even though you've all seen that in thousands of reviews over the last 10 months"

That's how I see the 4800H launch, anyway.
Posted on Reply
#4
TheLostSwede
Chrispy_
That's great, but none of the Renoir U-series have been made available yet.

They were presumably launched 5 weeks ago along with the H series which is great but the least interesting part of the entire Renoir lineup since the H series will all likely be paired with dGPUs.

The whole point of APUs is the integrated graphics.
Not true, Lenovo has one model, with a single SKU...
You can have it next business day even, assuming you live in the US.
www.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/ideapad/ideapad-500-series/IdeaPad-5-15ARE05/p/88IPS501393
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#5
Captain_Tom
This was reported over two months ago, all of this:

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#6
midnightoil
Captain_Tom
This was reported over two months ago, all of this:


Whilst I rather suspect that Intel co-marketing budgets will still hold far too much sway, performance metrics are likely going to be a bloodbath.

Probably even more so than desktop if this does have RDNA2.
Posted on Reply
#7
Chrispy_
TheLostSwede
Not true, Lenovo has one model, with a single SKU...
You can have it next business day even, assuming you live in the US.
www.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/ideapad/ideapad-500-series/IdeaPad-5-15ARE05/p/88IPS501393
Interesting. Lowest-end model, no reviews anywhere on the web, and not even any customer reviews on their own website.

Are we 100% sure that's accurate? Smells an awful lot like a website error that Lenovo have made before because they change the specs for a new revision without renaming the product itself. They also call things differently in each market, and there's some overlap between Thinkbook, Ideapad, Yoga, Flex depending on your region.

I'm currently subscribed to Lenovo's stock notifier for every Ryzen 4000-series they are offering on their website and have been since mid-february. So far not a peep from any of them, because the instant one is avaible in Europe with either a UK or International keyboard, I'm buying at least 10, maybe more.
Posted on Reply
#8
TheLostSwede
Chrispy_
Interesting. Lowest-end model, no reviews anywhere on the web, and not even any customer reviews on their own website.

Are we 100% sure that's accurate? Smells an awful lot like a website error that Lenovo have made before because they change the specs for a new revision without renaming the product itself. They also call things differently in each market, and there's some overlap between Thinkbook, Ideapad, Yoga, Flex depending on your region.

I'm currently subscribed to Lenovo's stock notifier for every Ryzen 4000-series they are offering on their website and have been since mid-february. So far not a peep from any of them, because the instant one is avaible in Europe with either a UK or International keyboard, I'm buying at least 10, maybe more.
Well, I don't know, but I got an ad about it the other day, only reason I knew about it, so I presume it's accurate. Not all U models with use LPDDR4x. Leaks out of China of multiple Huawei models that use DDR4 accounted for early benchmark figures.

Lenovo seems to be busy changing the naming scheme on a lot of products, while also introducing new models altogether, which might be why there's some confusion as to what is what.
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#9
Chrispy_
Yeah, I hope you're right. 4000 U-series are so desperately overdue at this point. I do know that LPDDR4 is more expensive so it won't be featured on the budget models most likely, it'll probably only come in the premium ultrabooks, or whatever the correct term is for an ultrabook that isn't trademarked by Intel.
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#10
windwhirl
TheLostSwede
Not true, Lenovo has one model, with a single SKU...
You can have it next business day even, assuming you live in the US.
www.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/ideapad/ideapad-500-series/IdeaPad-5-15ARE05/p/88IPS501393
Chrispy_
Interesting. Lowest-end model, no reviews anywhere on the web, and not even any customer reviews on their own website.

Are we 100% sure that's accurate? Smells an awful lot like a website error that Lenovo have made before because they change the specs for a new revision without renaming the product itself. They also call things differently in each market, and there's some overlap between Thinkbook, Ideapad, Yoga, Flex depending on your region.

I'm currently subscribed to Lenovo's stock notifier for every Ryzen 4000-series they are offering on their website and have been since mid-february. So far not a peep from any of them, because the instant one is avaible in Europe with either a UK or International keyboard, I'm buying at least 10, maybe more.
Lenovo's product search feature doesn't show you that particular model when filtering for laptops with AMD processors. Curious, isn't it?
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#11
notb
Chrispy_
That's great, but none of the Renoir U-series have been made available yet.
All OEM PCs using Zen CPUs come out long after the CPU launch. This is no different. That's how AMD plays it: announcing product early and giving you time to save cash. ;)

I wouldn't worry too much. Tiger Lake U probably won't be available before August. They have time.
They were presumably launched 5 weeks ago along with the H series which is great but the least interesting part of the entire Renoir lineup since the H series will all likely be paired with dGPUs.
But do they ship the H SoCs already?

If you look here:
uk.store.asus.com/laptops/gaming-series.html
All Zen2 laptops have estimated delivery dates set for May, June or unknown.
Posted on Reply
#12
R0H1T
Thought so ~ it's quite obvious that with the console chips ready, an RDNA2 based APU was always on the cards! Now just give us that famed 16GB HBM2e monster & we're golden :pimp:
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#13
medi01
I think "AMD iGPU is on levels of MX250" deserves more credit than "AMD has beaten Intel at iGPU" (how is the latter even news?)
Chrispy_
That's great, but none of the Renoir U-series have been made available yet.
Lenovo Ideapad 5 are out, delivery time ETA 2-3 weeks (looks like Lenovo bumped up screens last minute):

www.lenovo.com/de/de/laptops/ideapad/s-series/IdeaPad-5-15ARE05/p/81YQCTO1WWDEDE1

PS
Use WECARE10 for 10% discount.
Posted on Reply
#14
Chrispy_
notb
But do they ship the H SoCs already?
Shipping to the general public? I don't know - I haven't been paying attention to the H-series because they're not that exciting. Zen 2 has been in larger-format laptops from all the usual boutique builders for at least 9 months now. The only things that the H-series actually provides compared to desktop Ryzen 3000 used in these laptops is LPDDR4 support and an APU that doesn't get used in any of the models reviewed so far.

For what it's worth, I built a 3900X the other week and installed Ryzen master to check PBO and TDP were configured sensibly for 24/7 rendering at low noise levels before shipping it off. I ended up playing with the cTDP in the BIOS (an MSI Mortar MAX) and decided that a 3900X can actually get reasonable performance at 50W configured, with Ryzen master reporting 3.1-3.4GHz across all cores in a 24-thread stress test.

(No, I did not ship it off like this, I set it to 125W)
Posted on Reply
#15
R0H1T
Say what, all Renoir SKU support LPddr4x heck the U series are most likely to be paired with one.
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#16
Chrispy_
medi01
Lenovo Ideapad 5 are out, delivery time ETA 2-3 weeks (looks like Lenovo bumped up screens last minute):
Thanks, but that's just a pre-order. I see a lot of those from Lenovo and other retailers for mid-May onwards.

Nothing is actually out in the wild yet except the H-series which have been in the hands of many reviewers (at least a dozen different youtube reviews and another dozen website reviews so far). A couple of Zephyrus popped up on eBay that I saw from Reddit, and I'd have to guess that Asus made maybe a 1000 or so with an early, pre-COVID shipment of HS-series for reviewers and dumped the rest into the channel for scalpers to fight over.
R0H1T
Say what, all Renoir SKU support LPddr4x heck the U series are most likely to be paired with one.
I was referring solely to the Renoir H-series vs desktop Ryzen 3000-series comparison I'd made in the previous sentence.
I was not stating that only the HS Renoir variants support LPDDR4/X. I'll edit to clarify....
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#17
Assimilator
Until there's a product with a U-series CPU, that has been reviewed by a reputable source and can be ordered online, the U-series CPUs don't exist.
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#18
yeeeeman
Tgl launches in august this year. it will compete with renoir not cezanne. cezanne will have to compete with tgl successor.
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#19
Vayra86
Its not uncommon for products on new nodes to be rare for a while, but that does not mean they haven't been released. A release is when the product has a fixed list of specs and msrp; whether that is for OEMs or other channels or regular retail. That said, the period between 'release' and wide availability can't be too long.
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#20
medi01
Chrispy_
Thanks, but that's just a pre-order.
2-3 weeks delivery time, not too far from their normal timings.
Posted on Reply
#21
AnarchoPrimitiv
Captain_Tom
This was reported over two months ago, all of this:


HAHAHA, that's funny, because as soon as I saw the article title I immediately thought: "Wow, Moore's Law is Dead is correct"
Posted on Reply
#22
Xuper
Zen3 + RDNA2 + 16GB HBM = Win !
Posted on Reply
#23
ARF
Xuper
Zen3 + RDNA2 + 16GB HBM = Win !
16 GB HBM won't happen, if we are lucky dual channel DDR4-3200 :D
Posted on Reply
#24
ZakkWylde
TheLostSwede
Not true, Lenovo has one model, with a single SKU...
You can have it next business day even, assuming you live in the US.
www.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/ideapad/ideapad-500-series/IdeaPad-5-15ARE05/p/88IPS501393
Ordered one of these for the girlfriend today. How long do you reckon it will take to materialize?

Would have waited longer for the other 4000 series chips but she had to submit the receipt for a tech bursary from her university.
Posted on Reply
#25
Chrispy_
ZakkWylde
Ordered one of these for the girlfriend today. How long do you reckon it will take to materialize?

Would have waited longer for the other 4000 series chips but she had to submit the receipt for a tech bursary from her university.
Tuesday/Wednesday next week? I have no idea what shipping is like in the US But it would typically be a 48H service rather than a next-day service.
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