Monday, December 27th 2021

AMD Navi 24 GPU Powering RX 6500 XT Built on 6nm

AMD's first GPU built on the N6 (6 nm) silicon fabrication process isn't some big RX 7000 series behemoth, but the smallest chip from the Navi 2x GPU family, codenamed Navi 24. Based on the same RDNA2 graphics architecture as the rest of the RX 6000 series, the Navi 24 physically packs 1,024 stream processors across 16 compute units (8 WGPs), and on the RX 6500 XT, reportedly comes with 4 GB of memory across a 64-bit wide memory bus. The chip also packs a tiny 16 MB Infinity Cache. VideoCardz scored the first renders of the upcoming Radeon RX 6500 XT and RX 6400, which are based on the Navi 24. The RX 6500 XT features a full-height, 2-slot board design that uses a simple aluminium monoblock fan-heatsink. The RX 6400, on the other hand, is not just low-profile (half-height), but also single-slot.

Update Dec 28th: Unless we're mistaken, the SMDs near the PCIe interface in those renders seem to suggest that the GPU features a PCIe x4 interface. This should offer sufficient bandwidth for a GPU in this segment, and should help lower the pin-count of the GPU, as well as board costs.
Source: VideoCardz
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94 Comments on AMD Navi 24 GPU Powering RX 6500 XT Built on 6nm

#26
Ellertis
seth1911WTF from where did u come u think GPU are only for games :fear: :kookoo:
ehh a mistake, I wanted to say, gpus aren't only for games as an argument for your point that low end gpus are useless because they cannot run AAA games
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#27
TheinsanegamerN
EllertisSo people maybe will begin to understand that the miners aren't the only ones buying gpus but also gamers themselves?
Except there's no evidence that gamers are buying these cards. Steam doesnt really show the rx 6000 series gaining any traction, and the nvidia 1060 still has more users then all RTX 3000 cards combined.

Sure, you can say stteam isnt a great source, but no other sources can disagree with them. Where are all these gaming builds using $700 RX 6600s? I cant find any evidence they exist. OTOH, there is (weak) evidence that miners are using polaris GPUs, vegas, even laptops to mine.

It's much more likely that this is a paper launch, and that most production is still going to the far more profitable big cards that sell out in 10 seconds.
seth1911Miners arent the problem, the main problem are consumers they buy those card cause they need it like some people they need drugs too.
These two groups are not mutually exclusive.
seth1911I can spend 3000€ for a 3090ti but hell no ill dont do that, before that ill spend 3000€ in weed and beer.
In my opinion a 3090ti is a maximum 1000€ card, not even one cent more.
Agreed. GPUs ar enot like CPUs or RAM, they age like milk. Anything else in a modern build will ikely be usable 10 years from now, except the GPU.

Like today, if you had a build with a sandy bridge i5, DDR3 RAM, and a 64GB boot SSD, that system would be a bit slow but still usable for 60 FPS gaming today. The GPU, OTOH, would have either been a geforce 500 series or HD 6000 series (both now discontinued), the HD 6000 was abandoned with horrible drivers and the 500 series, while supported, is LMFAO tier slow today. If you built at the end of 2011, you MAY have been able to get a 7970, which aged better but is still awfully slow today.
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#28
mechtech
Ellertisat least for the same money you'll now get more powerful stuff, so it's not that bad
Um, well that was an entire desktop PC including the OS. I can't even get a video card for that now................
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#29
Ellertis
mechtechUm, well that was an entire desktop PC including the OS. I can't even get a video card for that now................
Welcome in a crisis, it's not like the current situation will last forever, try to remember 2017, people were saying the same things as right now
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#30
seth1911
there is no crisis if u can get the gtx 980 for under 200€.

Its only a marketing thing, stupid people buy new graphiccards for 3,4,500 € with lower performance than a 2. hand 980 for 200€ :roll:
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#31
opinali
At 16GB, it would be fair to call it the "Finity Cache". :D
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#32
Ellertis
opinaliAt 16GB, it would be fair to call it the "Finity Cache". :D
There is diminishing returns when growing it infinitly, with 1mb per CU its lower than other dies, but considering this gpu is for 1080p there isn't the need for that much cache as the more high end ones
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#33
DemonicRyzen666
TheinsanegamerNAs of right now, the average price for a rx 6600 is $700 in ameriland. It wouldnt surprise me to see the RX 6500 hit $500.

www.newegg.com/p/pl?N=100007709%20601394871

People said the RX 6600 wouldnt go past $450-500, at worse, since they didnt make much sense for miners, and yet here we are.....


Online retailer have been gouging all year, walking into best buy or micro-center there nowhere near these prices
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#34
opinali
EllertisThere is diminishing returns when growing it infinitly, with 1mb per CU its lower than other dies, but considering this gpu is for 1080p there isn't the need for that much cache as the more high end ones
Yep I was mostly joking :) just because the naming/branding "Infinity" certainly doesn't make much sense, since 16GB is nothing extraordinary compared to conventional L2/L3 cache sizes, for one example it's only 2X the L2 of the 3090, and smaller than a 12600K's cache not to mention any of the Ryzen3 CPUs.

Gamers should really beware that "1080p GPU" will be a serious descriptor for this product, considering also the VRAM bus and size, even games that it plays extremely well at 1080p should scale like garbage to anything higher, even 1440p.
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#35
Ellertis
opinaliGamers should really beware that "1080p GPU" will be a serious descriptor for this product, considering also the VRAM bus and size, even games that it plays extremely well at 1080p should scale like garbage to anything higher, even 1440p.
Yep
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#36
Daven
Chrispy_4GB of VRAM is what will make this unappealing to miners. Hopefully AMD can make enough of them to satisfy the now ridiculous demand for a half-decent entry-level card at sane prices.

I'm not holding my breath, initial pricing will be "market value" so likely a couple hundred bucks if it performs even remotely like a GTX980....


Based on specs alone, no. It would be a sidegrade, perhaps even a significant downgrade.

At best, this is half the performance of a 6600XT, so we're looking at GTX 1060 levels for the 6500. The tiny Infinity Cache and limited bandwidth may actually make this slower than even an old GTX 1060.
Depends on the clock speed over everything else.
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#37
HD64G
My calculation give that 6500XT will have 1660Ti level of performance @1080P and marginally below Vega56. Only price and availability will make it or break it.
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#38
opinali
Chrispy_I'm not holding my breath, initial pricing will be "market value" so likely a couple hundred bucks if it performs even remotely like a GTX980....
This may be an unpopular opinion, but AMD should move all these entry-level GPUs through the OEM/prebuilt channels. Gamers that want something close to DYI have reasonable options from custom builders like cybertron, nzxt etc., they still put a markup over MSRP for GPUs but less bad than any parts on retail. If I was a gamer/enthusiast without the resources for a midrange/high-end GPU today, I'd get one of these builds with something like a 6500 XT, hoping to replace that later.
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#39
TheinsanegamerN
DemonicRyzen666Online retailer have been gouging all year, walking into best buy or micro-center there nowhere near these prices
Best buy has worse stock issues then newegg. Oh sure, they're closer to MSRP. All 5 cards they get per month, that is.

Same at microcenter, sure their prices are somewhat better but still obscene, if they have them. And that assumes you are not like many where the nearest microcenter is a 3-4 hour drive away.
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#40
u2konline
Why bother to make these cards that have 64bit bus lol. stop it please. and 4gb? sigh. There's plenty of cards you can buy on the market that's better. Even my WX 4100 is faster than that card.
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#41
MentalAcetylide
TheinsanegamerNBest buy has worse stock issues then newegg. Oh sure, they're closer to MSRP. All 5 cards they get per month, that is.

Same at microcenter, sure their prices are somewhat better but still obscene, if they have them. And that assumes you are not like many where the nearest microcenter is a 3-4 hour drive away.
Best Buy is one of those resellers where you have some of the restock being set aside or immediately purchased by its employees either for friends who resell them for high prices or for someone's mining operation. Plus there's the added inconvenience of R2Dick2 bots patrolling the reseller sites for available stock. The fact that its near impossible to get these cards in the stores while seeing plenty of them being sold online at 3 times the MSRP tells me what I've said before: There's a lot of scumbaggery going on in the supply chain.

I'm also seeing some posters here saying that people buying these cards are to blame for the prices... well yes and no. Even if all the gamers agreed not to buy any of them, its not going to change the situation. You have to remember, these cards are also considered an asset that can be used to make money through scalping and mining. With the shortage of raw components, the scalping and mining feed on one another and just exacerbates the problem. So until crypto mining becomes much less profitable as opposed to outright buying it, or the card manufacturers take more steps to stabilize the supply chain and crack down on the ass grabbery going on with the resellers, its not going away.
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#42
Ellertis
u2konlineWhy bother to make these cards that have 64bit bus lol. stop it please. and 4gb? sigh. There's plenty of cards you can buy on the market that's better. Even my WX 4100 is faster than that card.
Look at it like mx series card on desktop bassicaly low power laptop gpu on desktop
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#43
r9
Now just make 16gb version for the people here who are into gimmicks.
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#44
Brendan9140
Chrispy_4GB of VRAM is what will make this unappealing to miners. Hopefully AMD can make enough of them to satisfy the now ridiculous demand for a half-decent entry-level card at sane prices.

I'm not holding my breath, initial pricing will be "market value" so likely a couple hundred bucks if it performs even remotely like a GTX980....


Based on specs alone, no. It would be a sidegrade, perhaps even a significant downgrade.

At best, this is half the performance of a 6600XT, so we're looking at GTX 1060 levels for the 6500. The tiny Infinity Cache and limited bandwidth may actually make this slower than even an old GTX 1060.
If the database’s relative performance is anything to go by, if that holds the same up until release- it’s saying the 6500 is on par with a 1060 6GB/RX 580
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#45
sam_86314
Oooooh, I want it!



OOooh, let me have it!

Here's hoping it'll be a decent price (it won't).
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#46
usiname
u2konlineWhy bother to make these cards that have 64bit bus lol. stop it please. and 4gb? sigh. There's plenty of cards you can buy on the market that's better. Even my WX 4100 is faster than that card.
WX 4100 - 96gb/s vs 128gb/s and 112gb/s
WX 4100 - 121 mm² 14nm vs 141mm² 6nm
wanna bet $1000 on which card is faster?
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#47
Makaveli
mechtechya no doubt, hindsight is 20/20 they say. I should have bought up a bunch of 8GB RX570/580s when they were under $200 CAD could have quadrupled my money in a mere 2.5 years.

I remember about spring 2011. I bought a mobo for about $130, a radeon 6850 for $130, and amd 955 cpu for $200, etc. etc. basically built a whole new desktop PC for $800 CAD. Now can't even get a basic video card for that. And that was a decent PC for 2011!!
I wish I did the same.

I sold my RX 580 8GB card for like $500 CAD 2 months ago.
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#48
ModEl4
I'm not too optimistic about these, even with higher clocks than 7nm (let's say 2847MHz for RX 6500XT) we will probably have regression to performance/$ regarding SRPs compared to $159 1650 super and $169 RX 5500XT 4GB!
If RX 5500XT 4GB is 100% in 1080p performance probably we will have something like below:
RTX 3050ti 8GB 139% $219-249 SRP
GTX 1660super 6GB 127% $229 SRP
RTX 3050 8GB 116% $179-199 SRP
RX6500 4GB 116% $199 SRP
GTX 1660 6GB 114% $219 SRP
GTX 1650super 4GB 101% $159 SRP
RX5500XT 4GB 100% $169 SRP
RX6400 4GB 94% $169 SRP (if not OEM only)
Also there is a possibility for a RTX 3050 4GB at probably -$20 vs the 8GB version that will further spoil the performance/$ image of RX 6500/6400!
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#49
watzupken
HD64GMy calculation give that 6500XT will have 1660Ti level of performance @1080P and marginally below Vega56. Only price and availability will make it or break it.
I don't think availability will be poor. If you look at the current RX 6600 series, they are pretty much available all the time. The only problem is the price. And this being fab on TSMC 6nm is more advanced on paper as compared the 7nm used by the higher end chips. So I don't expect prices to get any better.
I feel on paper, it will perform around a 1660 Ti. However the GPU is VRAM limited if it only have 4GB, and performance will quickly tank at high image quality settings. And at least based on observation of past 4GB cards from both Nvidia and AMD, the performance for the latter tends to drop faster. The not so distant RX 5500 4GB vs the GTX 1650 is a good example.
u2konlineWhy bother to make these cards that have 64bit bus lol. stop it please. and 4gb? sigh. There's plenty of cards you can buy on the market that's better. Even my WX 4100 is faster than that card.
I think pretty much any gaming capable GPU cost a lot now due to shortage and scalping at every level. Having said that, I feel that AMD's RX 6600 and lower GPUs are so gimped when it comes to specs, that they cannot perform well. This RX 6500 and 6400 is the ultimate gimp with meagre amount of cache, and narrow memory bus. While AMD can argue that the card will run games at a specific resolution and settings, but I suspect for unoptimised games, the performance will tank. And I really don't like to when AMD is artificially limiting overclocking and thus, limiting the potential of the graphic cards. If they want to give people reduced memory bus, at least have the decency to let people they and increase the memory bandwidth by overclocking the memory to its full or close to full potential.
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#50
Vayra86
watzupkenI think pretty much any gaming capable GPU cost a lot now due to shortage and scalping at every level. Having said that, I feel that AMD's RX 6600 and lower GPUs are so gimped when it comes to specs, that they cannot perform well. This RX 6500 and 6400 is the ultimate gimp with meagre amount of cache, and narrow memory bus. While AMD can argue that the card will run games at a specific resolution and settings, but I suspect for unoptimised games, the performance will tank. And I really don't like to when AMD is artificially limiting overclocking and thus, limiting the potential of the graphic cards. If they want to give people reduced memory bus, at least have the decency to let people they and increase the memory bandwidth by overclocking the memory to its full or close to full potential.
These low-end AMD GPUs smell like Huang's leather jacket. Not his new one either, but the one he's been wearing the past decade while leading.

Strange how that works :)

All the more reason to just be patient and wait the storm out. It will get better, eventually.
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