Wednesday, August 7th 2019

AMD's Latest AGESA Update Removes PCIe 4.0 Support from Pre-X570 Motherboards

AMD's latest AGESA update, which is being seeded to motherboard manufacturers, culls efforts to implement support for PCIe 4.0 in boards not carrying the latest X570 chipset. Some motherboard manufacturers had enabled support for the new standard on existing B450 and X470 motherboards - some with limited support, as was the case on some of ASUS' motherboards, others with full support. However, these efforts from motherboard manufacturers went against AMD's strategy with their X570 platform - all in all, these "rogue additions" reduced one additional feature of new X570 motherboards over their older counterparts.

The new AGESA code carries the part number AM4 1.0.0.3 ABB, and will likely be reflected in manufacturers' release notes for new BIOS versions that incorporate the code - and remove added PCIe 4.0 functionality. Other changes in this AGESA code release include fixes for Destiny 2 gamers' woes, which were having a hard time getting the game to run properly on Ryzen 3000 processors. If you're an avid Destiny 2 player and want PCIe 4.0 support, you'll likely be reminded of Rick and Morty's pickle episode. If not, you can always defer these AM4 1.0.0.3 ABB updates, if your system is behaving properly.
Source: PC Games Hardware.de
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143 Comments on AMD's Latest AGESA Update Removes PCIe 4.0 Support from Pre-X570 Motherboards

#76
danbert2000
It's not like PCIe 4.0 actually improves performance for any existing hardware. Even the SSDs that use it to get 4 GBps aren't that useful, since it doesn't even speed up application performance and you'd need two of them to copy a file more quickly than you already can. And the Techpowerup tests on the 5700 XT showed that it does nothing for GPU either. Sure, I know, AMD is bad for yanking something the motherboard vendors got working, but it is their chipset, and I doubt even 1% of people that installed that BIOS to get PCIe 4.0 ever even installed a compatible device.

PCIe 4.0 is for enterprise. It doesn't even matter to end users. AMD took away your bragging point, that's about it. X570 including it is all about PR. PCIe 4.0 support is there for EPYC and maybe Threadripper, the use in a personal desktop is next to nothing.
Posted on Reply
#77
RH92
danbert2000, post: 4094287, member: 165365"
It's not like PCIe 4.0 actually improves performance for any existing hardware. Even the SSDs that use it to get 4 GBps aren't that useful, since it doesn't even speed up application performance and you'd need two of them to copy a file more quickly than you already can. And the Techpowerup tests on the 5700 XT showed that it does nothing for GPU either. S
Sure ok we do understand this but this is not the problem raised here . The problem raised is why does AMD need to shut down a functionality that is already working, especially when board vendors ( who are the ones to be most affected interms of sale volumes / bad PR incase something isn't working properly ) are promoting this same functionality !

In other words we are talking about business ethics here , something that community cares alot when it comes to other companies but seems to arbitrary forget when it comes to AMD !
Posted on Reply
#78
moproblems99
cucker tarlson, post: 4094022, member: 173472"
I'm unaware now it's amd who have to deal with asus or biostar's rma tickets.but agree this should be verified,not just by manufacturer's word.
They don't deal with the RMA tickets. They deal with the bad press by morons on forums that would blame AMD for flakey PCIE4 on boards that weren't designed for it and they didn't want on it.

That said, I still do not approve of pulling. Sure as shit I'd throw some shade at Intel so I am going to throw some shade (and a little poo) in AMD's direction over this.
Posted on Reply
#79
eidairaman1
The Exiled Airman
zlobby, post: 4094191, member: 172939"
Putting the support in X470 mobos, then pulling it back? In motherboard culture that is considered a dick move.
It was mobo makers that enabled it on own accord, not AMD, AMD doesnt see it justifiable to allow pcie 4 due to their own testing, so if anything they just dont want backlash for potential instability
Posted on Reply
#80
Totally
RH92, post: 4094275, member: 174545"
So you are trying to tell me AMD kills the support for all manufacturers because MSI didn't do their job properly ( plus i have to remind you that MSI already addressed this issue with their newly released MAX boards cause surprise surprise peoples where blaming them not AMD .... ) how does this make any sense ? Since when does AMD work for MSI ? Im sure that would had made some headlines don't you think ...........
People on here were. To an image conscious AMD, they might be worried about what the uninformed consumer thinks when their cpu/mobo combo missing features, or breaks their existing setup when their a similar board based on their competitors is fully featured. So to avoid any confusion just axe it all together. Also if it comes to buying a new why not just buy a board with a 500 series chipset in the first place? Buying a new board isn't a fix. How is AMD working for MSI? So if a Supervisor/Management changes policy because of employee incompetence the bosses work for the people they hired?

EarthDog, post: 4094280, member: 79836"
Not to mention, other AIBs had/have smaller BIOS chips as well...

but what does this have to do with MSI........moving the goal posts??? lol
They were who I was reference to as the "lowest common denominator". So goal posts moved to where?
Posted on Reply
#81
Fierce Guppy
Xzibit, post: 4094145, member: 105152"
Am I reading this chart right ? Higher end boards don't support it while lower ends do. And half speed is Gen 3 x16 (Think everyone is in compliance there). Just find it funny how only the X470 low end TUF board support 4x16 but the higher ends don't. The majority of the lower end B450 support it but the higher STRIX don't.

For all the fuzz its just a M2_1 compliance chart. Still missing PCIe 4x16 and the 4x4 to SB

You could say, If you were buying ASUS you were better off buying their lower end stuff.
Yes, in this instance that would be true.

The thread is flecked with comments suggesting people will blame AMD should their non-compliant PCIe 4.0 mobos exhibit faulty behavior while utilizing PCie 4.0, and therefore to just remove the feature.
That isn't the nature of things. When there is an issue with the motherboard, NOBODY blames the chipset maker, especially not newbies. The first port of call is to blame the motherboard manufacturer. Asus, Gigabyte, MSI, ASRock know their products better than AMD. I'm pretty sure AMD wants to make PCIe 4.0 available to only X5xx series and upwards to get those sales.
Posted on Reply
#82
RH92
Totally, post: 4094321, member: 90126"
People on here were. To an image conscious AMD, they might be worried about what the uninformed consumer thinks when their cpu/mobo combo missing features, or breaks their existing setup when their a similar board based on their competitors is fully featured. So to avoid any confusion just axe it all together.
Oh yes i forgot AMD PR departement takes a look at TPU forums every morning , sees some random guy blaiming them about something he doesn't understand and acts accordingly ! Come on mate you can't be serious can you ?

First of all not only the amount of peoples blaming AMD for MSI issues was tiny compared to those who undertood where the issue was coming from but on top of that there will always be peoples blaming AMD for things they don't understand so how is this a solution to anything ?

Peoples blamed AMD about high voltage on 3000series CPUs ( and they still do ) yet i didn't saw AMD killing their CPUs all together ! Again this argument is nonsense !
Posted on Reply
#83
gmn 17
X670 chipset in 2020 with ddr5 support so new mobos again
Posted on Reply
#84
zlobby
gmn 17, post: 4094426, member: 100603"
X670 chipset in 2020 with ddr5 support so new mobos again
I wonder what can you say about intel then?
Posted on Reply
#85
Chomiq
RH92, post: 4094396, member: 174545"
Oh yes i forgot AMD PR departement takes a look at TPU forums every morning , sees some random guy blaiming them about something he doesn't understand and acts accordingly ! Come on mate you can't be serious can you ?

First of all not only the amount of peoples blaming AMD for MSI issues was tiny compared to those who undertood where the issue was coming from but on top of that there will always be peoples blaming AMD for things they don't understand so how is this a solution to anything ?

Peoples blamed AMD about high voltage on 3000series CPUs ( and they still do ) yet i didn't saw AMD killing their CPUs all together ! Again this argument is nonsense !
They don't need to check TPU, but they probably check Reddit and receive Twitts from people that encounter problems. Also, don't compare A) eliminating entire CPU line to B) disabling support for feature that was not in design specs for B450 and X470 boards. A) is completely out of question, while B) might save you from bad rep in long term.
Posted on Reply
#86
gmn 17
zlobby, post: 4094447, member: 172939"
I wonder what can you say about intel then?
Intel ice lake will have a new socket on consumer motherboards
Posted on Reply
#87
ZoneDymo
odd move by AMD tbh.
a motherboard manufacture should be free to offer whatever they can, if that leads to problems an a product breaks or needs to be replaced, thats on the manufacture to replace/pay for.

kinda hope mobo makers will just look for another work around.

(oh and stop it with all the silly fanboy remarks)
Posted on Reply
#88
EarthDog
gmn 17, post: 4094426, member: 100603"
X670 chipset in 2020 with ddr5 support so new mobos again
Lol, no.
Posted on Reply
#89
kings
RH92, post: 4094294, member: 174545"
The problem raised is why does AMD need to shut down a functionality that is already working
X570 is an in house chipset and its only selling point is the PCIe 4.0. So, if people start to have PCIe 4.0 in other boards, AMD would end up with many chips gathering dust on the shelves.

People can make whatever excuses they want, but it´s perfectly clear that this is a money driven decision more than anything else.
Posted on Reply
#90
RH92
Chomiq, post: 4094459, member: 185703"
They don't need to check TPU, but they probably check Reddit and receive Twitts from people that encounter problems.
TPU serves as an example , you can replace TPU with Reddit , Twitter and what not .

It's funny cause reading some of you guys one could believe there are hunderds of threads with peoples complaining about issues they have with PCIe 4.0 on older platforms wich is forcing AMD to give up on supporting it ....... sooooo could you please share some of those issues with us ( there must be dozens of them right ..... ) or are you simply talking about some kind of imaginary issues that could happen in the future if all the planets of the solar system are aligned in order to push your agenda ?

kings, post: 4094523, member: 180022"
People can make whatever excuses they want, but it´s perfectly clear that this is a money driven decision more than anything else.
Touche !
Posted on Reply
#91
Chomiq
RH92, post: 4094546, member: 174545"
It's funny cause reading some of you guys one could believe there are hunderds of threads with peoples complaining about issues they have with PCIe 4.0 on older platforms wich is forcing AMD to give up on supporting it ....... sooooo could you please share some of those issues with us ( there must be dozens of them right ..... ) or are you simply talking about some kind of imaginary issues that could happen in the future if all the planets of the solar system are aligned in order to push your agenda ?
We're not saying it's the situation ATM, we're saying that AMD actions are intended to prevent such situation from happening. Having people complain about not having Gen 4 on their B450/X470 is lesser evil in this case.

If it's not in spec you're at their mercy, if AMD says they won't allow it than people have to learn to deal with it.
Posted on Reply
#92
Flyordie
PCIe 4.0- Disabled by default on X470 boards. Problem solved.

Only allow it for the top PCIe x16 slot and the closest m.2 slot.

Don't list PCIe 4.0 as a feature on the X470 boards.

If AMD really is all gung-ho about being open and free, they'd have followed that plan.
Posted on Reply
#93
zlobby
kings, post: 4094523, member: 180022"
X570 is an in house chipset and its only selling point is the PCIe 4.0. So, if people start to have PCIe 4.0 in other boards, AMD would end up with many chips gathering dust on the shelves.

People can make whatever excuses they want, but it´s perfectly clear that this is a money driven decision more than anything else.
Another selling point is possibly security. Asmedia-made X370, X470 are proven to be full of crap, i.e. bugs and backdoors.

Only time will tell what X570 hides from us.
Posted on Reply
#94
eidairaman1
The Exiled Airman
zlobby, post: 4094639, member: 172939"
Another selling point is possibly security. Asmedia-made X370, X470 are proven to be full of crap, i.e. bugs and backdoors.

Only time will tell what X570 hides from us.
Inhouse Chipset, not ASmedia, hence the cost.
Posted on Reply
#95
kapone32
I honestly don't blame AMD for that. PCI-E 4.0 and 3.0 are completely different in terms of wiring requirements. Even the cheapest X570 have more layers on the PCB than the best X470 boards as a result of PCI-E 4.0.
Posted on Reply
#96
RH92
Chomiq, post: 4094598, member: 185703"
We're not saying it's the situation ATM, we're saying that AMD actions are intended to prevent such situation from happening. .
Oh yeah right , so AMD actions do intend to prevent a situation that COULD NEVER HAPPEN ....... this has nothing to do with the fact that PCIe 4.0 availability on older platform could harm X570 chipset sales ( in long term ) wich is an inhouse design ........ THIS IS TOTALLY NOT A MONEY DRIVEN DECISION ..... #HYPOCRISY#

Chomiq, post: 4094598, member: 185703"
If it's not in spec you're at their mercy, if AMD says they won't allow it than people have to learn to deal with it.
Well see now that's funny cause if someone had came up with this same answer ( just replace AMD by Intel ) back when Intel was getting sh*** storm about Coffee Lake compatibility with Z170/Z270 ( again rightfully so ) , he would had automatically been tagged as a fanboy ..... im telling you man , double standards , DOUBLE STANDARDS EVERYWHERE !!!
Posted on Reply
#97
Chomiq
RH92, post: 4094725, member: 174545"
Oh yeah right , so AMD actions do intend to prevent a situation that COULD NEVER HAPPEN ....... this has nothing to do with the fact that PCIe 4.0 availability on older platform could harm X570 chipset sales ( in long term ) wich is an inhouse design ........ THIS IS TOTALLY NOT A MONEY DRIVEN DECISION ! #HYPOCRISY



Well that's funny cause if someone had came up with this same answer ( just replace AMD by Intel ) back when Intel was getting sh*** storm about Coffee Lake compatibility with Z170/Z270 , he would had automaticaly be taged as a fanboy ..... im telling you man , double standards , DOUBLE STANDARDS EVERYWHERE !!!
And still, Intel got away with worse and they still own what? 80% of the market. I'll give AMD some slack with their decisions.
Posted on Reply
#98
eidairaman1
The Exiled Airman
RH92, post: 4094725, member: 174545"
Oh yeah right , so AMD actions do intend to prevent a situation that COULD NEVER HAPPEN ....... this has nothing to do with the fact that PCIe 4.0 availability on older platform could harm X570 chipset sales ( in long term ) wich is an inhouse design ........ THIS IS TOTALLY NOT A MONEY DRIVEN DECISION ..... #HYPOCRISY#



Well see now that's funny cause if someone had came up with this same answer ( just replace AMD by Intel ) back when Intel was getting sh*** storm about Coffee Lake compatibility with Z170/Z270 ( again rightfully so ) , he would had automatically been tagged as a fanboy ..... im telling you man , double standards , DOUBLE STANDARDS EVERYWHERE !!!
Its the mobo sockets being changed on intel every other year that is getting old.
Posted on Reply
#99
kapone32
eidairaman1, post: 4094732, member: 40556"
Its the mobo sockets being changed on intel every other year that is getting old.
Or sometimes every 6 months :D
Posted on Reply
#100
r9
Can these new BIOSes be modded ?
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