Friday, July 12th 2019

AMD Retires the Radeon VII Less Than Five Months Into Launch

AMD has reportedly discontinued production of its flagship Radeon VII graphics card. According to a Cowcotland report, AMD no longer finds it viable to produce and sell the Radeon VII at prices competitive to NVIDIA's RTX 2080, especially when its latest Radeon RX 5700 XT performs within 5-12 percent of the Radeon VII at less than half its price. AMD probably expects custom-design RX 5700 XT cards to narrow the gap even more. The RX 5700 XT has a much lesser BOM (bill of materials) cost compared to the Radeon VII, due to the simplicity of its ASIC, a conventional GDDR6 memory setup, and far lighter electrical requirements.

In stark contrast to the RX 5700 XT, the Radeon VII is based on a complex MCM (multi-chip module) that has not just a 7 nm GPU die, but also four 32 Gbit HBM2 stacks, and a silicon interposer. It also has much steeper VRM requirements. Making matters worse is the now-obsolete "Vega" architecture it's based on, which loses big time against "Navi" at performance/Watt. The future of AMD's high-end VGA lineup is uncertain. Looking at the way "Navi" comes close to performance/Watt parity with NVIDIA on the RX 5700, AMD may be tempted to design a larger GPU die based on "Navi," with a conventional GDDR6-based memory sub-system, to take another swing at NVIDIA's high-end.
Source: Cowcotland
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123 Comments on AMD Retires the Radeon VII Less Than Five Months Into Launch

#101
lexluthermiester
theoneandonlymrk, post: 4080530, member: 82332"
And AMD usually support a card with drivers beyond its useful gaming life so lets hopee this doesn't matter too much in the long run.
Radeon 7 is, like Vega and the RX series, GCN based and AMD will be supporting them for as long as they're in common use, which will likely be 5 or 6 years.
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#102
Chloe Price
Also I'd love to see a consumer card with 16GB VRAM....
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#103
bug
Chloe Price, post: 4080541, member: 123719"
Also I'd love to see a consumer card with 16GB VRAM....
Why not 1TB? Because that would be a waste?
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#104
theoneandonlymrk
bug, post: 4080542, member: 157434"
Why not 1TB? Because that would be a waste?
I'm tempted to put that comment in my signature, I don't imagine it will be long before that looks silly.
But for now fair enough ,it depends how fast and how it was used no?.
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#105
lexluthermiester
bug, post: 4080542, member: 157434"
Why not 1TB? Because that would be a waste?
Oh, I'm sure it could be done currently, but one has to consider the economy's of scale.
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#106
msimax
Chloe Price, post: 4080191, member: 123719"
Results please.
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#107
theoneandonlymrk
lexluthermiester, post: 4080546, member: 134537"
Oh, I'm sure it could be done currently, but one has to consider the economy's of scale.
It is already a thing ssg.

What if the Xbox next or ps5 have their attached storage closer to the gpu?.

They're both saying Special storage.
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#108
lexluthermiester
theoneandonlymrk, post: 4080595, member: 82332"
It is already a thing ssg.

What if the Xbox next or ps5 have their attached storage closer to the gpu?.

They're both saying Special storage.
?!?
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#109
theoneandonlymrk
lexluthermiester, post: 4080633, member: 134537"
?!?
1Tb attached sad(ssd, damn phone) on a radeon instinct ssg.

If everything can talk to memory and storage ,who is it that forces people to attach storage on the end of a io chain when it could be much more integrated between Gpu and Cpu (for Xbox ps5)
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#110
moproblems99
btarunr, post: 4079638, member: 43587"
Radeon RX 5700 XT performs within 5-12 percent of the Radeon VII at less than half its price
Where can you find a 5700XT for less than half of $699?
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#111
rvalencia
For non-RT hardware raytracing, RX 5700 Xt defeats RX Vega II in VRAY benchmark.

RV Vega II is pointless for AMD's shader based ray-tracing.




medi01, post: 4080391, member: 158537"
PS5 and XBox<whatever cryptic crap their marketing comes up with> are due on Xmas 2020, both promised RT.


The gap between V64 and VII is quite big and given the comments I read about 5700/XT, it made sense.
Atm, only Microsoft has claimed "hardware accelerated ray-tracing" while Sony stated 'support ray-tracing".

Sony in the past has played lose with ray-tracing claims with Killzone Shadow Fall's cheap rays.
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#112
bug
theoneandonlymrk, post: 4080545, member: 82332"
I'm tempted to put that comment in my signature, I don't imagine it will be long before that looks silly.
But for now fair enough ,it depends how fast and how it was used no?.
Well, it doesn't take a genius to come up with a bunch of uncompressed textures and then load them into VRAM all at once. Reviewers will use tools that monitor VRAM usage with no way to tell what's going on and we'll all conclude 1TB of VRAM is holding us back.
But why?
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#113
Bjorn_Of_Iceland
That is nice and all, but a quick question though.. would you still recommend a Radeon VII now? Asking for a friend.
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#114
bug
Bjorn_Of_Iceland, post: 4080878, member: 47228"
That is nice and all, but a quick question though.. would you still recommend a Radeon VII now? Asking for a friend.
No. For that kind of money, you can now get cards that perform better.
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#115
lexluthermiester
Bjorn_Of_Iceland, post: 4080878, member: 47228"
would you still recommend a Radeon VII now? Asking for a friend.
I would suggest yes, if you can find it and get it for a good price(less than $650 shipped)....
bug, post: 4080879, member: 157434"
No. For that kind of money, you can now get cards that perform better.
... if not, Bug is right, there are a good number of great cards that perform on similar levels for a good prices.
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#116
lynx29
newtekie1, post: 4080088, member: 20670"
We knew this was a stop-gap card when it was released.
Not really, the marketing at the time made it pretty convincing it was a new gaming card. Even the advert page for it on Newegg, etc. Not everyone is enthusiast like us, very easy to trick common people.
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#118
Amite
Admit it u would have killed to have one of these delivered to your door when they came out . AMD wise It still rules in the latest DX 12 games I think u could say maybe ))
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#119
ratirt
Bjorn_Of_Iceland, post: 4080878, member: 47228"
That is nice and all, but a quick question though.. would you still recommend a Radeon VII now? Asking for a friend.
I was going to buy RVii and honestly I'm glad I didn't. I mean it has the performance but the price is crazy. Especially now when Navi is out. The 5700XT is better in some games (if you game only) and costs a lot less. I'd pick 5700XT and leave RVii for people who want to do some work and would require 16GB ram and horse power this card has.
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#120
kapone32
lynx29, post: 4080958, member: 153071"
Not really, the marketing at the time made it pretty convincing it was a new gaming card. Even the advert page for it on Newegg, etc. Not everyone is enthusiast like us, very easy to trick common people.
Well it is faster than the Vega 64 (of which there were only 3 cards faster than) and came with double the HBM2 VRAM. It is noticeably faster than the Vega 64 at 4K, which is what the card was designed for. The 2080TI argument being touted around makes no sense vs the Vega 7 as that card is at least 20% more expensive to purchase. Navi is the only reason that I would not buy a Vega 7 right now. If people think that AMD is just going to release the 5700 series they are wrong. There has to be a card in the works to replace the Vega 7`s price point. It will probably be released in the 1st or 2nd quarter of 2020 to give Vega 7 a chance to go through the supply chain. AMD would not want to have those cards sitting in inventory. It will be interesting to see a couple months from now what kind of sales Navi is doing because that too will have an impact on when we see new Navi variants.
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#121
quadibloc
EarthDog, post: 4079712, member: 79836"
Who should we blame? Who made them expensive and hard to make in the first place? ;)
AMD chose to use HBM 2 in those cards to get the desired performance. HBM 2 just is expensive and hard to make; AMD didn't have the choice of somehow getting it cheaper or making it easier.
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#122
mccar42
xkm1948, post: 4079667, member: 50521"
Good. It was an awkward card TBH. Not very good for gaming, while not many will use it for computing due to lackluster support for CUDA and Tensorflow. At least nobody in Academia/Scientific research would pay for this as a “compute card”

Maybe good for crypto mining though.
I feel like it is basically a "workstation" card with a "Gaming" driver. I read an article from AMD that they were working on an alternative workstation-based driver, like their expensive workstation line up but not fully equal, that the Radeon VII/others could utilize; the access to a workstation oriented driver could make this into a much more powerful card in that arena. I mean look at the spec sheet on this beast it should be better than it is; and original $699 MSRP vs the likely >$1,000 "workstation" equivalent.

I feel like, on paper, this thing should be amazing yet it is like barely beating the 5700x :\

I am just a little salty and hopeful because I got the VII not realizing another, significantly cheaper, AMD card was around the corner ($400 vs $700 launch prices). I should have just put in a cheapo (relatively speaking) low-end card and waited a couple of months or dug my old r9 290x out of the closet.

The cost of the 16GBs of that shiny *new* HBM2 memory totally ate up the profitability of this card, though.

*just an opinion (note the "I feel"s) based on some research on this card prior to getting one several months ago as well as watching Gamers Nexus and other YouTube'ers. plus this info https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/radeon-vii.c3358 for "Relative Performance" of 5700 XT vs Radeon VII


#ButIDigress
Posted on Reply
#123
xkm1948
mccar42, post: 4087196, member: 189277"
I feel like it is basically a "workstation" card with a "Gaming" driver. I read an article from AMD that they were working on an alternative workstation-based driver, like their expensive workstation line up but not fully equal, that the Radeon VII/others could utilize; the access to a workstation oriented driver could make this into a much more powerful card in that arena. I mean look at the spec sheet on this beast it should be better than it is; and original $699 MSRP vs the likely >$1,000 "workstation" equivalent.

I feel like, on paper, this thing should be amazing yet it is like barely beating the 5700x :\

I am just a little salty and hopeful because I got the VII not realizing another, significantly cheaper, AMD card was around the corner ($400 vs $700 launch prices). I should have just put in a cheapo (relatively speaking) low-end card and waited a couple of months or dug my old r9 290x out of the closet.

The cost of the 16GBs of that shiny *new* HBM2 memory totally ate up the profitability of this card, though.

*just an opinion (note the "I feel"s) based on some research on this card prior to getting one several months ago as well as watching Gamers Nexus and other YouTube'ers. plus this info https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/radeon-vii.c3358 for "Relative Performance" of 5700 XT vs Radeon VII


#ButIDigress
Nah AMD cut FP64 and ECC from Radeon 7, it would be a pretty bad workstation card. Also bad CUDA/Tensorflow support makes it almost completely useless in professional use.

Radeon 7 is just for the ultimate AMD fans.
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