Wednesday, October 28th 2020

AMD Radeon RX 6000 "Big Navi" RDNA2 Graphics Card Launch Liveblog

After thoroughly appetizing us with its "Where Gaming Begins: Episode 1" event announcing the Ryzen 5000 series "Zen 3" processors that offer up to 19% IPC gains, in the second Episode, we see the company announcing its next-generation Radeon RX 6000 "Big Navi" graphics cards based on the RDNA2 graphics architecture that introduce full DirectX 12 Ultimate readiness, including real-time raytracing hardware. In the run up to the RX 6000, NVIDIA is already reportedly preparing product-stack updates. In this liveblog, we uncover what has NVIDIA riled up, and whether AMD can pull off better pricing and availbility than the RTX 30-series.

Update 15:59 UTC: It is time! Welcome to the Radeon RX 6000 Series live blog.
Update 16:01 UTC: AMD CEO Dr Lisa Su takes centerstage, fresh off a good quarterly results announcement, and that big Xilinx acquisition announcement.
Update 16:03 UTC: FarCry 6 seems like an AMD optimized title.

Update 16:03 UTC: Possibly the flagship product.
Update 16:04 UTC: AMD is where gaming begins because next-gen consoles trust it. - Dr Su

Update 16:05 UTC: 50% generational improvement in perf/W.
Update 16:06 UTC: 26.7 billion transistors, almost as big as GA102
Update 16:07 UTC: RDNA2 has a breakthrough high-speed design.
Update 16:08 UTC: AMD RDNA2 compute unit 30% more energy efficient.
Update 16:09 UTC: InfinityCache works to significantly improve memory bandwidth, based on the Zen L3 cache. More than 2.17x bandwidth gain despite 256-bit.
Update 16:10 UTC: 30% higher frequencies on the same 7 nm node.
Update 16:10 UTC: DirectX 12 Ultimate and DirectStorage support.
Update 16:11 UTC: Over 2X performance gain over RX 5700 XT.
Update 16:11 UTC: The RX 6800 XT!
Update 16:12 UTC: 4K Gaming from AMD is here! Matches RTX 3080!!!
Update 16:13 UTC: Hello competition!
Update 16:14 UTC: Welcome back ATI Rage, as the AMD Rage Mode.
Update 16:15 UTC: When paired with Ryzen, you get a gaming performance boost, 13% perf increase.

Update 16:15 UTC: AMD introduces its take on the NVIDIA Reflex, announcing latest Radeon Lag and Radeon Boost. No special API needed.
Update 16:16 UTC: Full DX12 Ultimate support, including ray-tracing. Woirking on a DLSS-rival.
Update 16:18 UTC: AMD is leveraging studios working on Xbox Series X / PS5 devs to integrate its Radeon features on the PC.

Update 16:18 UTC: FarCry 6, DiRT 5, WoW Shadowlands (which gets raytracing), RiftBreaker, are AMD-optimized.

Update 16:21 UTC: Available Nov 18, starts, $649

Update 16:21 UTC: Also announcing RX 6800 : faster than RTX 2080 Ti, 4K + raytracing ready
Update 16:22 UTC: $579, November 18 availability for the RX 6800.

Update 16:22 UTC: Lisa gets ready for a "one more thing"

Update 16:23 UTC: Radeon RX 6900 XT: 80 CUs, 65% perf/Watt over 5700 XT.
Update 16:25 UTC: RTX 3090 BEATEN!!!!
Update 16:26 UTC: December 8 for the RX 6900 XT, priced $999.
Update 16:26 UTC: OOF, we cannot wait to test these cards out!

Update 17:08 UTC: The press-release can be found here.

Update 17:19 UTC: The complete AMD slide deck follows.
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351 Comments on AMD Radeon RX 6000 "Big Navi" RDNA2 Graphics Card Launch Liveblog

#176
Khonjel
saikamaldoss
Easy-Peasy Chinesy... RX6700 with 54CU or 50CU if not will do a price cut on 6800 lol ha ha ha
The rumor mill/leaks so far lead to 6700 XT being Navi 22 aka 40 CU but with blistering clock speeds. But anyways who knows.
Posted on Reply
#177
windwhirl
r9
That 6800 kind of pricey at $579.
We're talking 4K performance and 16 GB of VRAM. Not a bad price all things considered.

I'd say RTRT too, but it's not clear how that fares.
Posted on Reply
#178
lynx29
TheLostSwede
Sounds like a nice dilemma to have.
I am leaning towards 5600 XT and 6800 XT, but honestly at the end of the day im going to order whatever i can click on fastest that is in stock on launch day for each.
Posted on Reply
#179
RedelZaVedno
Pricing with exception of 6900XT is a complete joke. Much worse than Zen 3, because Zen3 dominates Intel and RDNA2 does not.

-I mean $579 USD for RX 6800... No AI upscaling (DLSS), poorer RT implementation. You basically overpay $79 for 8 gigs of vram. Just awful.
-RX 6800 XT $649 USD, again no "DLSS", no RT benchmark comparison, the only reason for buying AMD is 6 gigs more GDDR6 and 50 bucks less. Not Enough by far.
-The only good GPU is 6900XT for $999.

AMD just shot itself in the foot again. This time without a reason. Rasterization performance is here, all AMD had to do was to substantially undercut Ampere Pricing (aka RX 6800 for $449 and RX 6800 XT for $599) and reviewers would have to say they're the smart buy option. As things stand today I expect NGreedia GPU division to grow market share even further into 90% mark at which point AMD being an underdog in discrete DIY GPU market becomes an understatement. So sad :(
Posted on Reply
#180
r9
lynx29
double the vram for an extra 79 bucks is a fair deal imo.
Personally I would take 6800 with 8gb for $449. I'll take the 4k chance.
Posted on Reply
#182
kings
I think that AMD missed an opportunity with the 6800. It's true that it has 16GB VRAM, but it should lose a lot in RT and it doesn't have any DLSS equivalent, being $79 more expensive.

In my view, AMD had made a better move to put this card with 8GB like the RTX 3070 and sold it below $500.
Posted on Reply
#183
wheresmycar
Its all about 1440p 144hz gaming for me and both the 6800 and 6800XT look amazing for the task.
Update 16:15 UTC: When paired with Ryzen, you get a gaming performance boost, 13% perf increase.
This is the bit which has me a little confused. These GPUs work better with Ryzen (assuming zen 3) CPUs? What am I missing here?
Posted on Reply
#184
Dave65
Damn some nice pricing for sure and that 16 gig.
Wonder how things are in the nvidia crowd today
Posted on Reply
#185
TheLostSwede
dragontamer5788
Its called decoy pricing.

6900 XT is the decoy, it exists primarily to make the 6800 XT look better.
Does that apply to the RTX 3090 as well then?
Posted on Reply
#186
Chomiq
EarthDog
Yep, I saw the same thing. You only get this 'significant' uptick when you have an AMD based system...

... but what, EXACTLY is that? Do I have to have a specific generation of CPU? Chipset? What about how these will fare on the MAJORITY of systems out there (intel based) that DO NOT get these boosts? Feels a bit misleading...(but par for the course from AMD/NV).
I think TPU's post cleared that up :
www.techpowerup.com/273934/amd-announces-the-radeon-rx-6000-series-performance-that-restores-competitiveness
  • AMD Infinity Cache - A high-performance, last-level data cache suitable for 4K and 1440p gaming with the highest level of detail enabled. 128 MB of on-die cache dramatically reduces latency and power consumption, delivering higher overall gaming performance than traditional architectural designs.
  • AMD Smart Access Memory - An exclusive feature of systems with AMD Ryzen 5000 Series processors, AMD B550 and X570 motherboards and Radeon RX 6000 Series graphics cards. It gives AMD Ryzen processors greater access to the high-speed GDDR6 graphics memory, accelerating CPU processing and providing up to a 13-percent performance increase on a AMD Radeon RX 6800 XT graphics card in Forza Horizon 4 at 4K when combined with the new Rage Mode one-click overclocking setting.
So Infinity Cache is on GPU die, Smart Access Memory is enabled on a 5000-series CPU, B550 or X570 board and a 6000-series GPU. Which means you shouldn't see a drastic decrease in base result on a non 5000 series CPU with similar performance.
Posted on Reply
#187
lynx29
TheLostSwede
Does that apply to the RTX 3090 as well then?
I know you have connections lostswede, get me a reserve spot for 5600x and 6800xt, you know you want to! :love:
Posted on Reply
#188
EarthDog
Dave65
Damn some nice pricing for sure and that 16 gig.
Wonder how things are in the nvidia crowd today
No F's given... competition is AWESOME!

That said, I'm surprised they reached 3090 levels... but I'd like to see results without overclocking (Rage) and Infinifty Cache (AMD only)...
Chomiq
I think TPU's post cleared that up :
www.techpowerup.com/273934/amd-announces-the-radeon-rx-6000-series-performance-that-restores-competitiveness
  • AMD Infinity Cache - A high-performance, last-level data cache suitable for 4K and 1440p gaming with the highest level of detail enabled. 128 MB of on-die cache dramatically reduces latency and power consumption, delivering higher overall gaming performance than traditional architectural designs.
  • AMD Smart Access Memory - An exclusive feature of systems with AMD Ryzen 5000 Series processors, AMD B550 and X570 motherboards and Radeon RX 6000 Series graphics cards. It gives AMD Ryzen processors greater access to the high-speed GDDR6 graphics memory, accelerating CPU processing and providing up to a 13-percent performance increase on a AMD Radeon RX 6800 XT graphics card in Forza Horizon 4 at 4K when combined with the new Rage Mode one-click overclocking setting.
So Infinity Cache is on GPU die, Smart Access Memory is enabled on a 5000-series CPU, B550 or X570 board and a 6000-series GPU. Which means you shouldn't see a drastic decrease in base result on a non 5000 series CPU with similar performance.
Ty!

Sorry, there are like 3 threads going on here about this subject... The one birdie posted, the live blog, and then the summary...

So, basically, it is the latest and greatest to get that performance. Cool beans. Awesome for those going balls deep into the ecosystem, bad news for the majority of existing PC owners that won't get the boost at all because they are running Intel.
Posted on Reply
#189
Cheeseball
Not a Potato
RedelZaVedno
Pricing is a complete joke. Much worse than Zen 3, because Zen3 dominates and RDNA2 doesn't. I mean $579 USD for RX 6800... No AI upscaling, poorer RT implementation. You basically overpay $79 for 8 gigs of vram. Just aweful.
RX 6800 XT $649 USD, again no "DLSS", no RT benchmark comparison, the only reason for buying AMD is 6 gigs more GDDR6 and 50 bucks less. Not Enough by far. The only good GPU is 6900XT for $999. AMD just shot itself in the foot again. This time without a reason. Rasterization performance is here, all AMD had to do was to substantially undercut Ampere Pricing (aka RX 6800 for $449 and RX 6800 XT for $599) and reviewers would have to say they're the smart buy option. As things stand today I expect NGreedia GPU division to grow market share even further into 90% mark at which point AMD being an underdog in discrete DIY GPU market becomes an understatement. So sad :(
Did you expect AMD to have some sort of AI/Tensor-focused implementation that could take on NVIDIA's DLSS? RDNA and RDNA2 are mostly rasterzation improvements which is mostly good for gaming and 3D workstation use. They've been brute-forcing power and it seems to be going well without overdoing the power consumption. This is a win-win for them regardless.
Posted on Reply
#190
R0H1T
Infinity cache is on die L2 or L2 (L2+L3 cache?) not sure where anyone got this idea that it depends on anything else! As for Smart Access Memory, I assume everyone forgot Heterogeneous compute (HSA) or unified memory pool? Well this is probably that one early implementation for it & no it you can't just add any (AMD) CPU to make it work.
Posted on Reply
#191
dragontamer5788
TheLostSwede
Does that apply to the RTX 3090 as well then?
Yup.

Decoy pricing is a fundamental marketing technique. It applies to both the low-end (why buy "small fries" when "medium fries" are just 10-cents more expensive for double the food?), as well as the high-end ($1500 is clearly not reasonable. So obviously $700 is a reasonable price).

------

Everyone does it. "i3" doesn't have enough features, "i7" is too expensive, clearly "i5" is the perfect CPU. Eventually, when Intel wants to sell more i7s, they invent the i9 so that the i9 can serve as the decoy and "nudge" people towards buying the i7.
Posted on Reply
#192
Chrispy_
kapone32
Isn't the 6800 competing with the 3080?
I think the XT is competing with the 3080, The vanilla 6800 is quite a significant CU and clockspeed chop from the 6800XT, I guess it may compete with a 3070Ti if Nvidia decide to officially counter it at $579.
Posted on Reply
#193
randompeep
Khonjel
It's funny now you mention smartphone market. Phone makers even Apple are making phones in ye olden days' $700 flagship prices again. Ofc they don't call it flagship but it's 90% flagship anyway.
In a world where the consumers become more & more strange/different from yesterday, the flagships are getting pricier. Also, the cost of production gets higher, so the profit...but I'd say everyone would be satisfied it the GPU market would be about seeing the full stack in the release day.
Too many poor kids are talking about the next-gen GPU, yet their budget for a new PC is 3-4 times smaller than the actual flagship product.
And yeah, as a consumer I except seeing more the first day with later add-ons (XT/Ti's) and gimmicks (power limit unlock for example).
BTW how you say 90% flagship for Apple products ? It's actually a really variable procentage, depending on the time of the year...but as for the Q4 of every year, I see Apple leading the smartphone/tablet market any hour. Both single core and multi core performance...I mean it's their Christmas beast mode 100% 1500$ per purchase season
So both nvidia and amd wanna join the campus somehow.
Posted on Reply
#194
BoboOOZ
kings
I think that AMD missed an opportunity with the 6800. It's true that it has 16GB VRAM, but it should lose a lot in RT and it doesn't have DLSS, being $79 more expensive.

In my view, AMD had made a better move to have put this card with 8GB like the RTX 3070 and sold it below $500.
I think it's not an interesting card for them to sell, it shares the same big die with the bigger brothers, so they lose money by artificially cutting down the die, because very few will have so many defective CU as to come naturally with only 60 CU.

I'm sure the 6700XT will be more interesting, so either buy a 3070 or a 6800XT, or wait for the 6700XT.
Posted on Reply
#195
RedelZaVedno
Dave65
Damn some nice pricing for sure and that 16 gig.
Wonder how things are in the nvidia crowd today
$80 for +8 gigs of GDDR6... Micron 1GB GDDR6 @ 14Gbps currently costs $6,86 when ordered in low quantities and much less if ordered in tons. You're paying double the price AMD pays for it. How is that a good deal?
Posted on Reply
#196
R0H1T
RedelZaVedno
How is that a good deal?
Really now? So do you buy groceries at the same rate farmers sell it to say Amazon or any other retailer :rolleyes:
Posted on Reply
#197
Vayra86
windwhirl

OK They fucking nailed it this time.

No further comments. Might switch for this.
Posted on Reply
#198
r9
AMD has both intel and nvidia between a rock and a hard place. Think of Big navi as just the beginning equivalent to the first Ryzen. Once they get some money to come from it will get even better for AMD.
Both intel and nvidia have the money to fight it, this will propel the tech game big time!
Posted on Reply
#199
lynx29
r9
AMD has both intel and nvidia between a rock and a hard place. Think of Big navi as just the beginning equivalent to the first Ryzen. Once they get some money to come from it will get even better for AMD.
Both intel and nvidia have the money to fight it, this will propel the tech game big time!
its glorious time to be a gamer that is certain.
Posted on Reply
#200
TheLostSwede
Cheeseball
The RTX 3080 only has four (by default). Which vendor had the one with five ports?
Some even have six.
Posted on Reply
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