Sunday, June 9th 2019

Sony PlayStation 5 Promises 4K 120Hz Gaming

Sony has finalized the design and specification of its PlayStation 5 entertainment system. Unlike buzzwords Microsoft threw around like "8K capable" for its "Project Scarlett" console, Sony has a slightly different design goal: 4K UHD at 120 Hz, guaranteed. The most notable absentee at E3 2019, Sony is designing the PlayStation 5 to leverage the latest hardware to guarantee 120 frames per second on your 4K display. Much like "Project Scarlett," the SoC at the heart of the PlayStation 5 is a semi-custom chip co-designed by AMD and Sony.

This unnamed SoC reportedly features an 8-core/16-thread CPU based on AMD's latest "Zen 2" microarchitecture, which is a massive leap from the 8 low-power "Jaguar" cores pulling the PS4 Pro. The GPU will implement AMD's new RDNA architecture. The SoC will use GDDR6 memory, shared between the CPU and GPU. Much like "Project Scarlett," the PS5 will include an NVMe SSD as standard equipment, and the operating system will use a portion of it as virtual memory. There will also be dedicated hardware for 3D positional audio. Sony also confirmed full backwards compatibility with PS4 titles.
Sources: The Verge, CNet
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95 Comments on Sony PlayStation 5 Promises 4K 120Hz Gaming

#1
dicktracy
At low settings. Without Ray Tracing. I'll give them a puncher's chance...
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#2
TesterAnon
Inb4 both use the same CPU and GPU.
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#3
AsRock
TPU addict
dicktracy, post: 4061798, member: 173119"
At low settings. Without Ray Tracing. I'll give them a puncher's chance...
Good gaming does not require ray tracing.
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#4
EzioAs
That sounds very doubtful. I mean great, if they can deliver it but unless they made it a requirements for published games to actually run at 4K/120 fps, I don't see many devs putting way too much effort target that, especially if they're going for more graphical fidelity than performance (4K/60 sounds more reasonable). Back compat is nice, and I'm also looking forward to their new Dual Shock controller.
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#5
arbiter
EzioAs, post: 4061805, member: 110948"
That sounds very doubtful. I mean great, if they can deliver it but unless they made it a requirements for published games to actually run at 4K/120 fps, I don't see many devs putting way too much effort target that, especially if they're going for more graphical fidelity than performance (4K/60 sounds more reasonable). Back compat is nice, and I'm also looking forward to their new Dual Shock controller.
Depends, its doable now if you dumb the graphic's down so you can get 120fps but i doubt they will have 120fps and look good.
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#6
Mussels
Moderprator
arbiter, post: 4061820, member: 106403"
Depends, its doable now if you dumb the graphic's down so you can get 120fps but i doubt they will have 120fps and look good.
a lot of popular games have simple graphics, minecraft, fortnite, etc.

i'm more curious about the monitor tech for that, are we using some new flavour of HDMI for this? Is Displayport gunna end up on TV's?
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#7
Reeves81x
Mussels, post: 4061829, member: 1746"
a lot of popular games have simple graphics, minecraft, fortnite, etc.

i'm more curious about the monitor tech for that, are we using some new flavour of HDMI for this? Is Displayport gunna end up on TV's?
prob just HDMI 2.1... why would they go with Display port?
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#8
Xzibit
Mussels, post: 4061829, member: 1746"
a lot of popular games have simple graphics, minecraft, fortnite, etc.

i'm more curious about the monitor tech for that, are we using some new flavour of HDMI for this? Is Displayport gunna end up on TV's?
The current Q*0R line from Samsungs use HDMI & support 1440p 120hz plus VRR. Max for the series on HDMI is 4096 x 2160 60Hz 4:2:2 12bit

LG had 4k 120hz at this year CES on HDMI 2.1
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#9
Mussels
Moderprator
HDMI just seems to have never ending issues with lack of bandwidth, compression etc so i was hoping they'd finally kill the damn thing off
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#11
king of swag187
TesterAnon, post: 4061800, member: 184515"
Inb4 both use the same CPU and GPU.
As with the Xbox One/PS4, likely similar CPU/GPU, just different clock rates, the One has it's CPU at 1.75ghz, the PS4 has it at 1.6, both Jaguar "8" cores. The GPU is slightly different, but still the same arch. R7 260 vs R7 270 iirc.
I'd hope both the Scarlett and PS5 are 8c/16t ~3ghz, with say a RTX 2070 level GPU, that'd check all my boxes.
But, as with the Xbox One, they originally announced it with a R9 280X tier GPU, but launched it with a R7 260.
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#12
Vayra86
Mussels, post: 4061848, member: 1746"
HDMI just seems to have never ending issues with lack of bandwidth, compression etc so i was hoping they'd finally kill the damn thing off
No man, HDMI was designed as an iterative purchase/upgrade motivator from the get go. What else to improve on and what better way to cut cost AND resell the same crap a few dozen times. That, and HDCP.

HDMI has no added features that benefit the end user in any possible way. Only limitations.

Metroid, post: 4061850, member: 178915"

Still gold. It just works. With the right cable. And GPU. And TV. And content... Woops. Content, that takes effort. *fail*
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#13
Vya Domus
Mussels, post: 4061848, member: 1746"
HDMI just seems to have never ending issues with lack of bandwidth, compression etc so i was hoping they'd finally kill the damn thing off
You need 48Gbps for uncompressed 4K 120HZ, that's 6 gigabytes per second. People struggle to get that on internal buses let alone cables that have to be a couple of meters long. It's not HDMI, this is insane no matter the standard.
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#14
Darmok N Jalad
king of swag187, post: 4061887, member: 180102"
As with the Xbox One/PS4, likely similar CPU/GPU, just different clock rates, the One has it's CPU at 1.75ghz, the PS4 has it at 1.6, both Jaguar "8" cores. The GPU is slightly different, but still the same arch. R7 260 vs R7 270 iirc.
I'd hope both the Scarlett and PS5 are 8c/16t ~3ghz, with say a RTX 2070 level GPU, that'd check all my boxes.
But, as with the Xbox One, they originally announced it with a R9 280X tier GPU, but launched it with a R7 260.
I think you may have some CPU specs mixed up. The PS4 had the faster hardware at launch, and then the Pro/X models scaled above 2.0 GHz, with the X having the edge. The PS4 Pro’s GPU was around that of the RX480 in specs, but with lower clocks.

I still don’t know how they will get that much out of a console, as desktops struggle with this with more power and financial budget. I know there is the usual fixed hardware advantage, but still. Anyway, I guess MS and Sony have to shoot for these to help others sell TVs. Why else would someone replace a perfectly good UHD TV?
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#15
Valantar
Unlike buzzwords Microsoft threw around like "8K capable" for its "Project Scarlett" console, Sony has a slightly different design goal: 4K UHD at 120 Hz, guaranteed.
Let's see.
Xbox"
[Person 1]We're looking at framerates up to 120 frames per second.
[Person 2]8k capability.
[person 3]Variable refresh rate.
Cnet, speaking to a Sony rep"
the device will offer ultra-high definition 4K visuals at 120Hz, which is twice the screen refresh rate of most TVs.
The Sony statement is, at best, a tiny notch less vague. This article reads like someone rather desperately trying to make Sony look better than Microsoft.
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#16
TheMadDutchDude
It'll be 4K on the display, but I guarantee you it will be 1080P upscaled. There's no way they will manage 4K at 120Hz native. No way.
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#17
Valantar
TheMadDutchDude, post: 4062065, member: 185664"
It'll be 4K on the display, but I guarantee you it will be 1080P upscaled. There's no way they will manage 4K at 120Hz native. No way.
The current gen (XBONE X) manages native 4k30 (no checkerboarding) in a decent selection of titles (though many/most titles use resolution scaling to maintain steady framerates, usually dropping down to around 1800p, or 1500p in extreme cases), and some lightweight titles even do 4k60. Dropping down to upscaled 1080p from this would be a very significant visual downgrade. I'd imagine they'd at the very least maintain resolution like now but with improved textures due to more VRAM, but I wouldn't be surprised if we saw native 4k120 in well optimized titles - and by that I don't mean very lightweight ones either. Might be a 4k120 target for "performance" modes in suitable games (esports in particular), with VRR making up for any shortcomings, and native 4k>60 for everything else where visual quality matters more.
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#18
ExplodingCaps
TheMadDutchDude, post: 4062065, member: 185664"
It'll be 4K on the display, but I guarantee you it will be 1080P upscaled. There's no way they will manage 4K at 120Hz native. No way.
Of course they’ll use upscaling technique. And they managed to get “4k” 30fps with their punny jaguar apu. From my perspective, it still can’t deliver 120 fps on triple A title with that upcoming specs, but I’m 100% sure they’ll bring “4k” 60 fps to the mainstream, and it’s a good thing to industry. Btw upscaled 4k games from ps4 aren’t that bad.
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#19
Metroid
I applaud Sony and Microsoft, is about time to use consumer cpus, compatibility and interoperability wise finally to work together making things to be developed a lot easier and cheaper and this will be a big plus for Windows 10 too.
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#21
Chomiq
I'll probably buy it, simply for the exclusive PS titles.
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#23
Reeves81x
Vya Domus, post: 4061964, member: 169281"
You need 48Gbps for uncompressed 4K 120HZ, that's 6 gigabytes per second. People struggle to get that on internal buses let alone cables that have to be a couple of meters long. It's not HDMI, this is insane no matter the standard.
you need 32.27Gbits for uncompressed 4k 10bit 120hz on hdmi 2.1, 25.82 Gbit/s for 4k 8bit 120HZ . Using Display Stream Compression 120Hz at 8K is possible on hdmi 2.1. Read the wiki ppl...

kid41212003, post: 4062291, member: 55555"
This seems more doable than Xbox's 8k.
Display Stream Compression
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#24
Darmok N Jalad
I'm still hoping for the day that AMD makes a system board that has an APU like this with a bunch of fast memory. You just plug in the SSD and install an OS and off you go. It could be somewhere in the SFF category. OEM partners could build crazy cases and cooling around them.
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#25
ToxicTaZ
Everyone is so 4K Gimmicky right now yet there is no such thing as 4K gaming basically fake hype.

I myself own 2080 NVlink setup and I tell you I can't run 4K properly by no means and it's much faster than Raeon 7 yet some how Navi 10/12 Architecture witch is slower than Radeon 7 is going to run 4K/120fps lol not without dropping graphics down from Ultra to Low settings and most likely Upscaling 2K to 4K tricks as they did with last generation consoles (Upscaling 720p to 1080p) the average consumers don't have a clue what game companies are doing.

You can have your 4K Low Graphics settings gaming.... I'll keep my 3K Ultra Graphics mode @90+fps...... Ultra mode or nothing!!
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