Friday, October 4th 2019

Intel 10th Gen Core X "Cascade Lake-X" Pricing and Specs Detailed

Ahead of their October 7th product launch and November availability, we have confirmation of the specifications and pricing of Intel's 10th generation Core X "Cascade Lake-X" HEDT processors in the LGA2066 package. These chips feature compatibility with existing socket LGA2066 motherboards with a UEFI BIOS update, although several motherboard manufacturers are launching new products with some of the latest connectivity options, such as 2.5 GbE wired Ethernet, and 802.11ax Wi-Fi 6 WLAN.

The 10th generation Core X HEDT processor family is based on the new 14 nm++ "Cascade Lake" silicon, which comes with hardware fixes against several classes side-channel vulnerabilities, and introduces an updated instruction-set that includes more AVX-512 instructions, and the new DLBoost instruction. DLBoost leverages new fixed-function hardware on silicon to accelerate AI deep-learning neural-set building and training by up to 5 times. Intel's first wave of 10th gen Core X lineup is rather slim, with just four processor models. The company did away with the Core i7 brand extension, as core-counts in the mainstream desktop segment have already reached 8-core. The lineup now begins at 10-core/20-thread, with the chip's full 48-lane PCI-Express and 4-channel DDR4 interfaces enabled across the board. All models feature the "XE" brand extension, and feature unlocked base-clock multipliers.
The Core i9-10900XE is your gateway to the series. This 10-core/20-thread chip comes with a fascinating price-tag of just USD $590, a significant drop from the $999 price for the previous-generation 10-core chip, the i9-9900X. It's clocked higher, with 3.70 GHz nominal, 4.50 GHz Turbo Boost 2.0, 4.70 GHz Turbo Boost Max 3.0 and 4.30 GHz all-core Turbo. The chip is endowed with 1 MB of dedicated L2 cache per core, and 19.25 MB of shared L3 cache.

The Core i9-10920XE is a $689 12-core/24-thread chip priced under AMD's upcoming flagship AM4 model, the Ryzen 9 3950X. It's marginally faster than its predecessor, the i9-9920X, with 3.50 GHz base clocks (same), 4.60 GHz Turbo Boost 2.0, 4.80 GHz Turbo Boost Max 3.0, and 4.30 GHz all-core turbo. Interestingly, the increase in core-count doesn't bring additional L3 cache, you get the same 19.25 MB.

The next step in this series is the $784 Core i9-10940XE, a 14-core/28-thread processor clocked at 3.30 GHz, with 4.60 GHz Turbo Boost 2.0, 4.80 GHz Turbo Boost Max 3.0, and 4.10 GHz all-core turbo. Yet again, you get just 19.25 MB of shared L3 cache. Interestingly, Intel did not plan a 16-core/32-thread model in this series, you jump straight to the flagship.

Leading the pack is the Core i9-10980XE, an 18-core/36-thread processor priced at a mouth-watering $979, which is less than half that of the previous-generation Core i9-9980XE. It ticks at 3.00 GHz, with 4.60 GHz Turbo Boost 2.0, 4.80 GHz Turbo Boost Max 3.0, and 3.80 GHz all-core turbo. You get a larger 24.75 MB of shared L3 cache. All four chips have their TDP rated at 165 W.
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121 Comments on Intel 10th Gen Core X "Cascade Lake-X" Pricing and Specs Detailed

#101
Patriot
efikkan, post: 4128314, member: 150226"
You should wait for benchmarks of actual workloads, not synthetics like Geekbench etc. which has leaked this far.
The problem for high core count Cascade Lake will be heat. As long as they can stay within similar clocks, they will remain competitive.


Nope, they were released several months ago, but those prices, yuck. :(
Cinebenchr15 is leaked as well, but yes it tends to not care about latency as much which is where DAW and like workloads will most likely fall in intel's favor.
I brain farted at 2am when I posted that... yes Xeon-w was released at Xeon prices in june but there have been more recent mentions of intel releasing i9 on the socket and there appears to be a 26 and 28c HEDT waiting in the wings to take on threadripper that is not the 3k chip. Competition is good. :)
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#102
MazeFrame
Will be interesting to see the i9-10920XE (what the hell is that naming scheme?) against the 3900X.
Intel has double the L2 cache, but 1/3rd the L3 cache.
48 PCIe lanes, again? Is the fear of cutting into their server segment so big?
24 PCIe lanes from the PCH -> Bottleneck all your storage.

Just noticed, the 10 core (10900xe) is price wise up against the 3900x. I think the winner from that is clear.
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#103
efikkan
Patriot, post: 4128355, member: 77367"
Cinebenchr15 is leaked as well, but yes it tends to not care about latency as much which is where DAW and like workloads will most likely fall in intel's favor.
That kind of illustrates my point. Cinebench is a benchmark of Cinema4D, which is relevant for those running Cinema4D.
But the mistake that many do is to extrapolate "general performance" of various CPUs based on Cinebench, which is very misleading considering Cinebench scales very differently from the CPU's actual "general performance" across a variety of workloads.
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#104
Valantar
Patriot, post: 4128355, member: 77367"
Cinebenchr15 is leaked as well, but yes it tends to not care about latency as much which is where DAW and like workloads will most likely fall in intel's favor.
I brain farted at 2am when I posted that... yes Xeon-w was released at Xeon prices in june but there have been more recent mentions of intel releasing i9 on the socket and there appears to be a 26 and 28c HEDT waiting in the wings to take on threadripper that is not the 3k chip. Competition is good. :)
Intel can't go beyond 18 cores in socket 2011 - there isn't room for a bigger die in that package.

This is the 9980XE, which uses the 18-core HCC die. It is slightly below 500mm2 (around 21.6x22x4mm).

This is the Xeon W-3175X, which uses the 28-core XCC die. It is nearly 700mm2, at 21.6x32.3mm. There is no way that die can fit onto a Socket 2011 substrate - it's simply too large.

Which is why the 28-core is on socket LGA3647. Fitting that die onto a smaller substrate would not only require disabling a significant amount of I/O (due to loss of pins) but also redesigning the IHS and socket retention mechanism entirely. Not something Intel is likely to do.

They might be able to squeeze more cores in on 10nm, but that isn't arriving for chips this size any time soon. Yields would be utter garbage.
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#105
Shatun_Bear
Vayra86, post: 4128351, member: 152404"
Eh... that is just your color of glasses being in the way I suppose.

When it comes to Intel's market share and leadership then yes, the money is, was and has been in server and mobile for quite some time now. The desktop PC market is dwindling year after year and this has never been a secret. So in the context of 'Intel is screwed'... this definitely applies and it did apply the last ten years. Those ten years, AMD couldn't make a dent in either of those markets OR the desktop.
Oh gee wow, really? Thanks for your great insight and this amazing revelation, I've never heard it before...

This topic is about Intel's HEDT. I've got a simple simon revelation for you now: HEDT means HIGH END DESKTOP, I couldn't care less how many dual-core mobile laptops Intel sells to insurance businesses, in the HEDT space, Intel is screwed so please try to come to terms with it.
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#106
efikkan
Valantar, post: 4128374, member: 171585"
<snip>
They might be able to squeeze more cores in on 10nm, but that isn't arriving for chips this size any time soon. Yields would be utter garbage.
The largest known die for Ice Lake-SP so far is 26 cores with 8 memory controllers.
I would not be surprised if larger core configurations would consist of two dies.
Posted on Reply
#107
Valantar
efikkan, post: 4128408, member: 150226"
The largest known die for Ice Lake-SP so far is 26 cores with 8 memory controllers.
I would not be surprised if larger core configurations would consist of two dies.
8 memory controllers sure doesn't sound like something suited to a 4-channel socket with just 2011 pins. Intel needs 3647 pins for 6 channels, AMD needs more than 4000 for eight, so that die definitely isn't destined for normal HEDT - unless they follow AMD's lead with Threadripper and use a trimmed-down version of their highest end socket for HEDT, of course.
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#108
efikkan
Valantar, post: 4128462, member: 171585"
8 memory controllers sure doesn't sound like something suited to a 4-channel socket with just 2011 pins. Intel needs 3647 pins for 6 channels, AMD needs more than 4000 for eight, so that die definitely isn't destined for normal HEDT - unless they follow AMD's lead with Threadripper and use a trimmed-down version of their highest end socket for HEDT, of course.
The socket for Ice Lake-SP has been known to be LGA-4198 for over a year now.
What this means for Ice Lake-X (and -W?) variants remain unknown.
Posted on Reply
#109
Valantar
efikkan, post: 4128467, member: 150226"
The socket for Ice Lake-SP has been known to be LGA-4198 for over a year now.
What this means for Ice Lake-X (and -W?) variants remain unknown.
That is true, but I don't think it's likely for Intel to make two separate XCC dice, so the only option then would be to use a version with at least half the memory controllers and a heap of PCIe disabled for HEDT. It is possible (that's what AMD has been doing, after all) but I think quite unlikely. That would entail quite the loss of profits compared to selling the same silicon as fully enabled LGA4198.
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#110
Vayra86
Shatun_Bear, post: 4128394, member: 166032"
Oh gee wow, really? Thanks for your great insight and this amazing revelation, I've never heard it before...

This topic is about Intel's HEDT. I've got a simple simon revelation for you now: HEDT means HIGH END DESKTOP, I couldn't care less how many dual-core mobile laptops Intel sells to insurance businesses, in the HEDT space, Intel is screwed so please try to come to terms with it.
You're way overinflating things. Chill out. As much as Intel has a problem today for a prospective buyer of an HEDT system, most people are still sitting on an Intel rig with little urge to upgrade. When they do, they will likely consider Ryzen or TR. Its a slow crawl to get more market share though. As much as Intel doesn't have the top offering, they still have the largest market share by far, and it will take many years for that to change. Many years in which 'Intel is NOT screwed', they can get by just fine. Many years in which they have time to find something to counter AMD.

Get it now?
Posted on Reply
#111
efikkan
Valantar, post: 4128485, member: 171585"
That is true, but I don't think it's likely for Intel to make two separate XCC dice, so the only option then would be to use a version with at least half the memory controllers and a heap of PCIe disabled for HEDT. It is possible (that's what AMD has been doing, after all) but I think quite unlikely. That would entail quite the loss of profits compared to selling the same silicon as fully enabled LGA4198.
As you know, for Skylake-SP/X and Cascade Lake-SP/X intel makes three dies; LCC(10 core), HCC (18 core) and XCC(28 core), all of which have 6 memory controllers. From these they make the Xeon scalable platform(Skylake-SP and Cascade Lake-SP) called Bronze, Silver, Gold and Platinum, which support various multi-socket configurations. For the HEDT/workstation market they have three partially overlapping platforms; X299, C422(LGA2066) and C621(LGA3647), but only X299 have a decent motherboard selection.

There is no reason why a HEDT CPU with all memory controllers would compete with Xeon SP. HEDT is optimized for maximum performance and use "normal" ATX style motherboards, while Xeon SP is energy efficiency optimized and usually run on other motherboard form factors suitable for server racks.

I would prefer if Intel made one HEDT/workstation lineup like AMD does today, and enabled as many memory channels and PCIe lanes as possible. If they really have to sell some CPUs without all memory channels or ECC for yield issues, then they can sell these as cheaper CPUs on the same platform.
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#112
Patriot
Valantar, post: 4128374, member: 171585"
Intel can't go beyond 18 cores in socket 2011 - there isn't room for a bigger die in that package.

This is the 9980XE, which uses the 18-core HCC die. It is slightly below 500mm2 (around 21.6x22x4mm).
This is the Xeon W-3175X, which uses the 28-core XCC die. It is nearly 700mm2, at 21.6x32.3mm. There is no way that die can fit onto a Socket 2011 substrate - it's simply too large.
Which is why the 28-core is on socket LGA3647. Fitting that die onto a smaller substrate would not only require disabling a significant amount of I/O (due to loss of pins) but also redesigning the IHS and socket retention mechanism entirely. Not something Intel is likely to do.

They might be able to squeeze more cores in on 10nm, but that isn't arriving for chips this size any time soon. Yields would be utter garbage.
I didn't say they were going to put more cores on 2066, btw 2011-3 had 22 cores...
I said Intel plans to replace the 3175X either bringing i9 to 3647 or making another high binned Xeon-W
Guessing they will be using some of the dies they binned for cooperlake to try and stave off Threadripper 3000 total domination at a more reasonable TDP.

But in the June cascade lake refresh they did not release a 3175x replacement.
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#113
efikkan
This information about Tiger Lake have apparently been in circulation for a while but have completely escaped me. So at least they are preparing the graphics driver for potential desktop parts, without any guarantee of when or if they will actually release. Intel have stated that Ice Lake-SP will ship in Q2 2020, so hopefully we can see desktop and HEDT parts later in 2020 too.
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#114
notb
Shatun_Bear, post: 4128394, member: 166032"
This topic is about Intel's HEDT. I've got a simple simon revelation for you now: HEDT means HIGH END DESKTOP, I couldn't care less how many dual-core mobile laptops Intel sells to insurance businesses, in the HEDT space, Intel is screwed so please try to come to terms with it.
Since we look at 2066 mostly to learn what features could at some point go into mainstream (e.g. AVX-512, DLBoost lately), this is also how we should perceive Intel's troubles here. Does this concern us? Does it have a meaningful impact on the stuff Intel really wants to sell?
And the answer is: not really. AMD's advantage here stems from a bigger socket (SP3 vs 2066) and a smaller node, so they're able to fit more cores. That's it.

Keep in mind LGA2066 is just "high-end consumer" in the Intel's current lineup. They're not selling Xeons on this socket anymore (they're either LGA1151 or LGA3647).

If you just want to discuss HEDT as a separate lineup... there isn't really much to talk about. It's tiny and irrelevant. Even if 2066 just stopped selling today, it wouldn't have any impact worth discussing.
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#115
Gungar
ZoneDymo, post: 4127179, member: 66089"
I mean, better pricing then the price gauging going on before (like Nvidia is doing atm) is good yes... but its odd to use the word "impressive" for it imo.
I mean, they are still making a lot of profit on these so why would you be impressed by them asking less money then they were before?
I guess you could be impressed by AMD to actually force Intel to start cutting down their prices?

Not trying to make it a whole debate though, but for example imo it would be impressive if they could do those 14 cores while consuming less power then a 9700k or something, that would be a technological leap, that would be impressive.

anywho, moving on :p
They forced Intel to go cheaper architecture, i am not impressed by that.
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#116
efikkan
notb, post: 4128618, member: 165619"
Keep in mind LGA2066 is just "high-end consumer" in the Intel's current lineup. They're not selling Xeons on this socket anymore (they're either LGA1151 or LGA3647).
Actuall, Intel just updated the lineup today.
Xeon W-32XX is LGA3647
Xeon W-22XX is LGA2066
and still Xeon E-22XX is LGA1151
So the confusion continues…
Posted on Reply
#117
notb
efikkan, post: 4129015, member: 150226"
Actuall, Intel just updated the lineup today.
Xeon W-32XX is LGA3647
Xeon W-22XX is LGA2066
and still Xeon E-22XX is LGA1151
So the confusion continues…
Yes! I did not see that coming. :-D

Actually it takes some confusion away. The principle stands: Xeons are for production use (mission critical systems). Everything else does consumer + business (non-production).

Intel basically said: we can't put as many cores as we want on LGA1151 successor and OEMs told them LGA3647 is just too big.
I bet this wouldn't happen if Intel could put 16 cores on the small socket, but that's at least a year away.
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#118
Chrispy_
Curious to see the TDP on these, and if the TDP is reasonable, how long they can actually spend at boost clocks.

When you start talking about large chips like these, power consumption is the key bottleneck and 14nm just doesn't seem to be cutting it anymore, no matter how many plus symbols you add after the 14.
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#119
jayjr1105
Chrispy_, post: 4129994, member: 185623"
Curious to see the TDP on these, and if the TDP is reasonable, how long they can actually spend at boost clocks.

When you start talking about large chips like these, power consumption is the key bottleneck and 14nm just doesn't seem to be cutting it anymore, no matter how many plus symbols you add after the 14.
Doesn't matter. Intel TDP is useless. A 9900K is listed at 95w but will pull well over 200w on an AVX workload.
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#120
Chrispy_
jayjr1105, post: 4130158, member: 190965"
Doesn't matter. Intel TDP is useless. A 9900K is listed at 95w but will pull well over 200w on an AVX workload.
True, but this is AMD we're talking about. Their TDP is actually both accurate, real-world representative and user-configurable, especially when it comes to laptops with additional sensors and things like STAPM (skin-temperature aware power management).

TDP for laptops really matters, because thermal headroom and cooling is any laptop's biggest performance constraint.
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#121
HwGeek
So if the latest leaks are correct then looks like AMD gonna Troll Intel and announce their new TR lineup just before those 10th gen x299 CPU's reviews go live, it will make them DOA ;-).

AMD won't miss the one time opportunity to step on Intel and continue with their "New Leader-New Rules" ha?.
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