Thursday, June 22nd 2017

No Relief for DRAM and NAND Shortages in Sight; Considerable Supply Only in 2018

DRAM prices have been high for quite some time now, due to a general increased demand over a slowly improving supply capability from manufacturers. Pricing of DRAM has been increasing (to the tune that if I wanted to double my memory capacity, I would have to pay double of what I paid a mere 11 months ago.) NAND pricing has been affected as well, with newer technologies such as 3D NAND not having a relevant impact on end user pricing as was expected, since tight supply and growing demand means process-level savings are dwarfed by the increasing prices on the balance of supply and demand.

Most of our woes can be traced back to high-end smartphones, which make use of up to 6 GB of RAM and have copious amounts of NAND memory. Now, reports are coming in that due to the iPhone 8's impending launch, supply is even tighter, with several firms being either unable to secure the amount of Ram they are looking for, or having to order in significant advance (futures speculation anyone?) Reuters is reporting that some clients have moved to 6-month supply agreements for their DRAM and NAND purchases, accepting higher prices than the customary quarterly or monthly deals, to make sure they get enough memory chips for their products.
Amidst these woes, and if you add in the current mark-up on almost all GPUs being sold to the public due to the crypto mining craze, it's probably one of the most expensive moments to build a new PC from scratch, or even to slightly upgrade your machine. And relief in the DRAM and NAND channels is expected to only come by around 2018, and only from the supply side of the equation (you can bet demand will only keep on rising.) Additional factories from Samsung and SK Hynix are expected to start production in early 2018.Source: Reuters
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15 Comments on No Relief for DRAM and NAND Shortages in Sight; Considerable Supply Only in 2018

#1
Chaitanya
Collusion or demand from mobile market, not a good sign for consumers.
Posted on Reply
#2
TheGuruStud
Literal fake news to hide their scam.
Posted on Reply
#3
Prima.Vera
TheGuruStud said:
Literal fake news to hide their scam.
The news are real, but the reason behind them is fake. I suspect very much the DRAM/NAND cartel wanting to jack up the prices for their products due to high amount of greed.
But that's OK. I will be so happy when their 1000$ phones will remain unsold, and they expensive SSDs/DDR4 RAM sticks will have the same fate. I will be very curious if they will keep the same prices...
Callous basterds.
Posted on Reply
#4
cyneater
TheGuruStud said:
Literal fake news to hide their scam.
I was thinking the same thing...
Posted on Reply
#5
Parn
Prima.Vera said:
The news are real, but the reason behind them is fake. I suspect very much the DRAM/NAND cartel wanting to jack up the prices for their products due to high amount of greed.
No doubt about that.
Posted on Reply
#6
Liviu Cojocaru
Yep this seems like a dirty marketing move. They expect us to believe that nobody anticipated the demand for these chips...
Posted on Reply
#7
HopelesslyFaithful
Liviu Cojocaru said:
Yep this seems like a dirty marketing move. They expect us to believe that nobody anticipated the demand for these chips...
excepting demand to increase and not wanting to expand in order to make more money off supply and demand is not price fixing.

Price fixing is agreeing with everyone that you will not increase production and all agree to a ridiculous price.

Companies purposely making limited supply to get higher prices is not price fixing. They are simply being smart....douche...but smart.

This is how the fashion world works and niche markets and it isn't illegal or immoral. They just play off idiots who are willing to pay for it.

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/competition-guidance/guide-antitrust-laws/dealings-competitors/price-fixing
Posted on Reply
#8
5DVX0130
Same old BS. It happened with DDR1, DDR2, DDR3, HDDs, … just cartel economics.
I completely understand them though. Why not do it? Pay the pocket change penalties (IF you’re caught), and rake in the billions in the meantime.
Posted on Reply
#9
5DVX0130
HopelesslyFaithful said:
excepting demand to increase and not wanting to expand in order to make more money off supply and demand is not price fixing.

Price fixing is agreeing with everyone that you will not increase production and all agree to a ridiculous price.

Companies purposely making limited supply to get higher prices is not price fixing. They are simply being smart....douche...but smart.

This is how the fashion world works and niche markets and it isn't illegal or immoral. They just play off idiots who are willing to pay for it.

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/competition-guidance/guide-antitrust-laws/dealings-competitors/price-fixing
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DRAM_price_fixing
http://en.cade.gov.br/press-releases/cade-condemns-companies-for-international-cartel-of-memory-chips-1

I'm too lazy to post more, and you probably know how to use Google.
Posted on Reply
#10
Solaris17
Creator Solaris Utility DVD
5DVX0130 said:
Same old BS. It happened with DDR1, DDR2, DDR3, HDDs, … just cartel economics.
I completely understand them though. Why not do it? Pay the pocket change penalties (IF you’re caught), and rake in the billions in the meantime.
Seriously /slap $30k anti trust lol ok here ya go.
Posted on Reply
#11
HopelesslyFaithful
5DVX0130 said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DRAM_price_fixing
http://en.cade.gov.br/press-releases/cade-condemns-companies-for-international-cartel-of-memory-chips-1

I'm too lazy to post more, and you probably know how to use Google.
never said it hasn't happened in the past but your wildly speculating and jumping to accusations that are baseless like a fool.

There is very realistic evidence this case is pure economics and not price fixing. Once you post real proof that today is price fixing i will listen but you are making baseless claims.

Prove your baseless accusations...if not shut up.

Today is not price fixing as i showed you the definition of what price fixing is.
Posted on Reply
#12
5DVX0130
HopelesslyFaithful said:
never said it hasn't happened in the past but your wildly speculating and jumping to accusations that are baseless like a fool.

There is very realistic evidence this case is pure economics and not price fixing. Once you post real proof that today is price fixing i will listen but you are making baseless claims.

Prove your baseless accusations...if not shut up.

Today is not price fixing as i showed you the definition of what price fixing is.
Seeing as the same thing keeps on repeating every couple of years, my chances are quite high that I’m right. At least higher than yours. It also keeps being on proven in court, and its been admitted by the industry a couple of times now, that YES it was price fixing.

But as I said, “why not?”.
By now it’s already a calculated risk, and not just in the DRAM industry. Nothing you can’t learn about, it does require a fair amount of reading though.

Before I show you my evidence, can you show me some of the very realistic evidence that you’re talking about? Because I haven’t been able to find any. Well at least nothing that wasn’t manufactured by or linked to the “industry”.

“Today is not price fixing as i showed you the definition of what price fixing is.”
You haven’t shown me anything of value. All you did was voice your opinion, as did I.
Posted on Reply
#13
timta2
HopelesslyFaithful said:
excepting demand to increase and not wanting to expand in order to make more money off supply and demand is not price fixing.

Price fixing is agreeing with everyone that you will not increase production and all agree to a ridiculous price.


Companies purposely making limited supply to get higher prices is not price fixing. They are simply being smart....douche...but smart.

This is how the fashion world works and niche markets and it isn't illegal or immoral. They just play off idiots who are willing to pay for it.

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/competition-guidance/guide-antitrust-laws/dealings-competitors/price-fixing
You are contradicting yourself here. Lowering production or keeping production low and agreeing with competitors on pricing, is the very definition of price fixing.

Price fixing is an agreement between participants on the same side in a market to buy or sell a product, service, or commodity only at a fixed price, or maintain the market conditions such that the price is maintained at a given level by controlling supply and demand.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_fixing

HopelesslyFaithful said:
never said it hasn't happened in the past but your wildly speculating and jumping to accusations that are baseless like a fool.

There is very realistic evidence this case is pure economics and not price fixing. Once you post real proof that today is price fixing i will listen but you are making baseless claims.

Prove your baseless accusations...if not shut up.

Today is not price fixing as i showed you the definition of what price fixing is.
That's like asking someone to prove that the stories and characters in The Bible are/were real. You can't provide proof of something, when someone is hiding that proof from you or doing something in secret.
Posted on Reply
#14
john_
A few years ago a flooding showed to the companies how you can find a good excuse to increase prices of a product that it's price was falling from a cliff for many years. Now memory manufacturers have found excuses to keep their prices and profit margins high. Every year they will have a new excuse to say, in the form of a high end smartphone model.
Posted on Reply
#15
Frick
Fishfaced Nincompoop
No relief in sight; relief comes in 2018.
Posted on Reply
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